June 29, 2006
An Open Skies observation mission of the Six Nations Reserve? [Update]
Was there indeed a spy flight over the Six Nations Reseve?
Update [12:45pm on June 30]
I just got off the phone with LCol Reid McBride, responsible for Open Skies working in the Arms Control Verification Directorate of the Strategic Joint Staff in National Defence in Ottawa. With his permission, he is letting me use his name. He assures me with, with 100% certainty, that no Open Skies missions have been conducted in Canada over the last several months. We chatted about some of the finer points of the treaty, including some elements of particular relevance to Caledonia. For example, the treaty puts a limit on resolution for imagery, no better than 30cm. At that resolutuion, you can tell a tank from a truck, but you would find it impossible to evaluate a bunker, for example.
So what flew over the area? He says it could have been a cargo plane in a holding pattern waiting to go to Hamilton. Lots of cargo planes for smaller haulers are flying old DC-8s and 707s.
In other words, in the words of this professional, this was certainly an innocent coincidence.
more...
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It's entertaining to imagine that the residents of the reservation are worthy of the sort of expensive attention that a real spy plane could direct at them. It's just as likely that this plane was visiting the Hamilton museum, or perhaps associated with the Oshawa aviation expo during the weekend.
If it were I trying to "spy" on these folks, I'd rent a teeny airplane, fly low & slow, and take some fine pictures with a telephoto-lensed camera. But really ... could the "intelligence" so gathered be worth even those few hundred bucks?
Posted by: Frank Ch. Eigler at June 29, 2006 01:00 PM (6Pk56)
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I would tend to think that a small plane and a telephoto lens would not provide the government the kind of detail they would need if they were interested in confirming the "bunker" claims made by some people around the site. A plane like the one described would provide detail and intelligence in one pass that would take a small plane and a single camera hours to record - and that would be if you could shoot every square inch of the property. There is also other equipment on that kind of plane that would provide additional intelligence. Not a stretch to believe that a pass over the area wouldn't be requested by the Canadian government. Especially if they believe that the protestors and warriors have been less then truthful in their 'peaceful' claims.
Posted by: ProudAcadian at June 29, 2006 01:13 PM (DDEvT)
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More likely it was a BAE 146 RJ. This is a small commercial airliner. They are operated in Canada by Air Canada and possibly others.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAe_146
Posted by: Kevin at June 29, 2006 01:21 PM (ccJEe)
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I have flown as a passenger on the BAe_146. Most are flown in the US by commuter airline like US Air. I can assure you the plane I saw over Caledonia was not a BAe_146. The BAe_146 has a high over the fuselage wing configuration, under slung engines and a Tee tail. They also have newer Turbofan engines which are distinctive because of their larger diameter when compared with the Pratt & Whitney TF33-P-5 Turbofans
The plane I saw cross the sky in Caledonia had an under fuselage wing configuration and a lower horizontal stabilizer - not a high Tee tail. It was also much larger then the BAe_146 and did not have the distinctive paint job of most airlines - it appeared gray from the underside. It was easy to see as it was no more then 3 or 4 thousand feet up as it crossed Caledonia.
Also, Air Canada does not operate BAe_146's.
http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/current.html
Posted by: SickandTired at June 29, 2006 02:08 PM (ifMNO)
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With all due respect, doesn't this kinda sound like a Meaghan Moon bat (or whatever alias she's using at the moment) black helicopter scenario?
Posted by: BrianLemon at June 29, 2006 02:45 PM (PjbIr)
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The US airforce jet you speak of, and I believe the eye witness is correct, is a Boeing 707 heavily modified for intelligence gathering by a very broad array or sensors, not limited to photography. These sensors are highly classified, and capable of collecting visual, electronic and IR signals as well as some that are too classified to discuss. Possibly wall-penetrating radar ect.
I suspect that if indeed the Canadian government requested the fly-over, it was to collect and analyse the radio frequencies used by the terrorists and to take clear and acurate mapping of the site. All this means is that 'something' is gonna happen soon....and it won't be good for the terrorists....at least I HOPE that is the case.
That chickenshit McShifty is too much of a coward to do the dirty work, so has asked the feds, or possibly the military to do it for him.
Posted by: arctic_front at June 29, 2006 03:06 PM (YGvLW)
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It wasn't a black helicopter, it was a gray plane ;-)
I hear what your saying, I am only reporting what I saw fly over Caledonia. Was it taking pictures? I can't say... Was it a spy plane? Who knows. Maybe it was some third world cargo carrier still flying 4 engine 707's, Although 707s are no longer employed by major US airlines, many can still be found in service with smaller non-US airlines, charter services and air cargo operations. Although I haven't seen a civilian 707 in probably 15 years. Not to many large 4 engine - small diameter fuselage planes around anymore...
Posted by: SickandTired at June 29, 2006 03:07 PM (ifMNO)
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Was it CIA?
There are some rumours the occupiers have had some consultations from groups with ties to the Palestinians.
These are just rumours not facts, I'm just offering a plausible explaination.
It could also have been just a charter by the government to make the Natives think some hi-tech government org. is spying on them (read: they won't be dealing with the OPP next time).
Posted by: gimbol at June 29, 2006 03:35 PM (uDj9I)
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Like I said in another thread, I saw this aircraft: (www.pbase.com/ bryan_murahashi/image/54740225) the Orion sub hunter fly over my place in Ancaster earlier this week. Possibly Monday or Tuesday. The one I saw was grey, I couldn't make out the markings to tell if it was American or ours.
Its pretty far to the ocean from here, that's all I'm sayin'.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 29, 2006 05:56 PM (nAMT1)
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Like I said in another thread, I saw this aircraft: (www.pbase.com/
bryan_murahashi/image/54740225) the Orion sub hunter fly over my place in Ancaster earlier this week. Possibly Monday or Tuesday. The one I saw was grey, I couldn't make out the markings to tell if it was American or ours.
Its pretty far to the ocean from here, that's all I'm sayin'.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 29, 2006 05:58 PM (nAMT1)
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The Orion is a propeller-engined plane. It also has a distinct projection out of the back. I am not saying it was not over Ancaster, it was not the plane I saw over Caledonia. It was definitely a Jet Engines plane. At the altitude it was at, it was plainly visible and the sound was distinct. There is no mistaking the sound of a jet engine plane climbing away from you...
Posted by: SickandTired at June 29, 2006 06:34 PM (ifMNO)
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They are worried that Al Qaeda is going to use the Indian reserves as a staging point for an attack with weapons of mass destruction...not such an outrageous possibility, really (the enemy of my enemy is my friend)...X-Ray them down to the molecule, I say.
Posted by: Sticky at June 29, 2006 08:41 PM (l0uK/)
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who are "they" sticky? if you mean you and I are worried then you're absolutely correct. I fear the "nations" are being used as an in to this country for far more nefarious shenanigans...
as for planes and such couldn't you just google earth? zero right in on 'em?
Posted by: kelly at June 29, 2006 10:37 PM (/IrGj)
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The problem with Google earth is two fold. The resolution isn't good enough to see down to the fine detail needed to determine a house from a pile of dirt in low resolution areas. Only certain areas of the country have high resolution areas available. You can tell these areas as darker sections when you zoom in. Actually, there is a high resolution area just to the South West of Caledonia, but not in Caledonia (interesting to see Six Nations reserve as it shows clearly with all the trees).
The other problem with Google Earth is that the images are complilations of photos that are often years old. Try zooming in where new highways are now and you will see what I mean. In fact, Douglas Creek Estates (Caledonia) in Google Earth shows a green field - indicating that it is still farm land. The site has been cleared for homes and is only brown dirt now.
The pictures on Google Earth are not live images from 'spy' satellites.
Posted by: medicman at June 29, 2006 11:27 PM (DDEvT)
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I just had a scary thought and I hope someone can ease my mind. Isn't the foundation of a democracy the rule of law? Aren't the courts the final say? If I recall correctly the Ontario Supreme Court ordered the police and the Gov't of Ontario to restore order in Caledonia. Did the justice rescind that order, as it doesn't seem that the police and the Ontario Gov't are obeying the order. If the police and Gov't can get away with ignoring the court are we that far from anarchy?
Posted by: mike at June 30, 2006 12:09 AM (3F0kf)
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With that lying coward McGuinty and the other snivelling coward, his AG Bryant, supposedly running things we are not far from a complete inssurection. These scumbags need to be tossed out now never mind 2007.
Posted by: Pissedoff at June 30, 2006 08:16 AM (bK3SU)
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Like I said in the earlier thread, this is the sheerest sort of black-helicopter nonsense. If I'm not mistaken low-level airways V84 and V443 both traverse the reservation's airspace and meet at intersection NORCH. Lots of aircraft of all types use these pre-defined low-level airways.
Additionally, keep in mind this is summer, entering the height of the air show season, and any number of airframes based on the 707 (i.e. KC-135, OC-135, WC-135, RC-135) will be flying all over North America doing nothing more sinister than heading to podhunk airfields across the continent to sit on static display for a couple of days.
I have seen 55 Wing's most exalted PHOTINT and ELINT spy aircraft like the RC-135V/W on the tarmac at London and Hamilton air shows, for instance, and these birds have to fly over
somebody to get there.
Posted by: Chris Taylor at June 30, 2006 10:23 AM (H0lcY)
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Unless somebody just put a bunch of stamps on the side and let the post office worry about it.
Posted by: Jay at June 30, 2006 11:05 AM (+OEIf)
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I really resent that Liberals think advancing anti-American ideas will lead to success at the polls.
Anti-American themes show up in their latest money appeal newsletter, [today, June 30/06].
===== quote part of the LPC Email ====
and half-hearted subsidies, Mr. Harper is aligning Canadian policy with that of George BushÂ’s United States.
Which of these Harper policies do you think most aligns Canada with George BushÂ’s United States?
* Cancelling CanadaÂ’s commitment to the Kyoto Accord
* Assigning Fixed Election Dates
* Catering to the NRA-style gun lobby
* Destroying the Kelowna Accord
* Tax increases for the poor, and tax cuts for the rich
* Arming CanadaÂ’s Borders
* Bowing to US Softwood Lumber Demands
Seven policies: Seven steps towards a Republican Canada.
ItÂ’s time to shine a spotlight on Stephen HarperÂ’s real agenda. More than ever, the Liberal Party of Canada needs your help to defeat this emerging threat.
Here are some ways you can make a difference right now:
1) MAKE A DONATION TODAY to the Liberal Party of Canada
========= End Quote=====
Sorry,
I will never donate to those who bash Generous Good hearted Americans while they hold off Jihadist terrorists bent upon our destruction. TG
Posted by: TG at June 30, 2006 11:30 AM (2GVBQ)
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I'd like to take a moment to address your post with all of the seriousness and consideration that it warrants... BWAHAHAHAHA!!!
There you go. Wack-job...
Posted by: z_geist_the_spook at June 30, 2006 11:53 AM (JxhdH)
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Kelly: 'They' are the gov't agency that OK'd the spy plane fly-overs...I think it's a really good idea...they should be checking for radiation and bio weapons as well.
Posted by: Sticky at June 30, 2006 11:59 AM (MMF//)
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I will leave the discussion about 'spy planes' to the guys that are working on their first tinfoil hat. As for the liberal pamphlet, I find it disgusting and not just a little sad that there are people that will fall for that'hidden agenda' crap AGAIN. Personally I hope Harper can sway enough people in Ontario to give him a majority come next election.
Posted by: Rick at June 30, 2006 12:17 PM (qe9Nn)
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Not to disparage the good LCol, but Hamilton's hold points are Toronto VOR, London VOR, and COLTS intersection, none of which are anywhere near the reserve.
It was probably an aircraft climbing along one of the low-level airways on its way to cruise altitude and enroute transit along a high-level airway.
Posted by: Chris Taylor at June 30, 2006 12:33 PM (H0lcY)
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Hamilton's HAMILTON SEVEN departure from Rwy 24 has aircraft climb to 3000ft ASL on the runway heading (239 true) until assigned radar vectors. Heading 239 from the runway end carries departing aircraft directly over the reserve.
There's your answer. Everyone can put away the tinfoil now.
Posted by: Chris Taylor at June 30, 2006 12:44 PM (H0lcY)
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I say put a permanent blimp over the land with high end cameras and start looking at facial recognition software, count warm bodies with thermal sensors, investigate with high end radar to count weapons and emit high frequency noise directly at the land to impede cellular tower operation and airwave cable signals, walkie talkies, etc.
I wish the cop Sean Connery played in the Untouchables was our premier instead of that gutless yellow bellied mcshifty. He'd have this resolved in a matter of days, if not hours.
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 30, 2006 12:54 PM (Xiqvi)
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I can only report what I saw. The flight was from the East (west bound) flying a low level (3000 to 4000 feet) and not climbing (level flight) until after it got past Caledonia, then it climbed agressively. Did not look like it was in a pattern or regular circling Mount Hope flight path.
I identified the plane from it's appearance as I had a good look at it. It could also have been...
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=100
Or...
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=121
But from the angle I saw the plane, I don't think it was a JointStar as it did not appear to have the protrusion under it's front.
Maybe it was a US plane on it's way to an airshow and wanted to 'have a look' at the area. Or maybe it was an old 707 cargo plane that had left Mount Hope and also wanted to have a look before climbing away.
Anyway, if it was a 'spy plane', I am sure that a simple call to an official would have confirmed it was and they would have exposed all. That is what intelligence services do, isn't it?
Posted by: SickandTired at June 30, 2006 01:40 PM (DDEvT)
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It still sounds entirely consistent with a departure profile from Rwy 24. The runway heading (239) is a west-southwestern course -- just thirty degrees off 270.
Did you see black "USAF" block-text and the star decal on the underside of the wing? They are pretty large and hard to miss.
Posted by: Chris Taylor at June 30, 2006 03:09 PM (H0lcY)
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Dang!
Was hoping for our own homegrown version of Roswell...
...well, my tinfoil hat was getting hot in the sun...
Posted by: tomax7 at June 30, 2006 04:07 PM (jHhd0)
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Didn't notice any markings under wing...
Be careful with the tinfoil hat, they show up on satellite photos... ;-)
Posted by: SickandTired at June 30, 2006 04:50 PM (ifMNO)
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"Did the justice rescind that order, as it doesn't seem that the police and the Ontario Gov't are obeying the order."
I can answer this: The OPP uphold the laws of Ontario and Canada. The Supreme Court of Canada has ruled that aboriginals addressing land claims' issues are not to be removed like criminals. Canada's land claims process is so slow and so far behind, that the grievances of the aboriginals are quite valid, and violence is not called for. The Supreme Court of Canada trumps an Ontario injunction. The OPP are upholding the law.
Posted by: saga at June 30, 2006 09:10 PM (ae3LI)
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"that the grievances of the aboriginals are quite valid, and violence is not called for. The Supreme Court of Canada trumps an Ontario injunction. The OPP are upholding the law."
While I will agree that not enforcing the injunction might fit into your description, not arresting aboriginals who are attacking a camera crew and stealing their equipment while standing by and watching is not upholding the law.
I also agree with your point that violence is not called for and hope the aboriginal protestors will continue to refrain from any further violence.
Posted by: medicman at June 30, 2006 10:36 PM (ifMNO)
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The doctor hopes that impulsive warriors who have prison records because they have a habit of resorting to violence upon impulse, will behave with restraint.
That is a high degree of hopefulness.
very commendable. TG
Posted by: TonyGuitar at July 01, 2006 08:37 AM (2GVBQ)
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Americans... please note.
Do not be offended. There is no general dislike of US citizens in Canada.
There is a mistaken thought on the part of the Liberal Party of Canada that Bush bashing gives them that independent feisty quality that Canadians love to vote for.
The 1820s have long gone and the combative dislike for American musketeers has long dissipated as well.
Please pay no attention to a disgraced and defeated Liberal Party of Canada.
I worry that the Liberals may fade away completely. We do need them to split the vote of our National Dipstick Party.
The NDP are a sort of socialist / communist mix who would provide every citizen with every service for free. All free services would be paid out of corporate profits and our natural resources.
We would all become 450 pound state dependants until the economy crashed. Then we would all enjoy going straight, living on bread and water until we got used to working again. Utopia! TG
Posted by: TonyGuitar at July 01, 2006 09:11 AM (2GVBQ)
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The plane was probably the OPP's PILATUS observation aircraft, based near me. It has FLIR, THERMAL IMAGING SENSORS, and can take a picture of me, clearly picking my nose, from 10,000 feet in TOTAL DARKNESS...the technology existed to read the time offa someone's WRISTWATCH, from 100 miles up in Space existed way back at least to 1966.
Posted by: Feldwebel Wolfenstool at July 03, 2006 07:37 AM (Y1ykG)
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Oh who the hell cares if a plane flies over... jeez, fly over my house and take all the pictures you want, I could care less.
It sounds like whoever saw the plane has no freaking clue what type of plane it is, and used the power of google to come up with the most insidious sounding one...
Whatever. Who cares.
Posted by: Heather Cook at July 03, 2006 09:47 AM (4SQNC)
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...obviously someone who wants people to visit their goodapple blogspot cares.
Nice to know you have nothing to hide that the government might want to take pictures of...I feel safer now.
Posted by: medicman at July 03, 2006 10:21 AM (ifMNO)
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June 28, 2006
More rumours of impending Canada Day violence [and ongoing updates]
I have yet another email, also difficult to substantiate, from someone close to the events in Caledonia. As before, I am posting it with a warning that none of the content is confirmed.
This time, the focus is on plans for a violent Canada Day long weekend in Caledonia:
Subject: Friday Night
Just got off the phone with my contact who lives on Thistlemore. Person visited yesterday by a rep. from the Ministry of Housing and Municipal Affairs. Their purpose is to assess the amount of damage and costs incurred by the residents during this "Event". There were 5 questions. The rep took the questions with her but left an overview. My contact is photo copying this and bringing it over tomorrow [ed. I'd like to see it too, if I can].
There is increased activity at DCE. After the removal of the barricades, there were 2 out houses. Yesterday they brought in 5 more. They have been hauling in wood all day yesterday and today. They are stacking them in huge pyres.
Scanners are picking up on-going communication from the Warriors saying that they are going to help the Caledonians celebrate Canada Day festivities. No mention of specifics just continuous excitement over this coming weekend. My uneducated guess is that if they do show up at the dance, they will just stand and watch. Intimidate by presence. They hope that the Caledonians, fuelled with fire water will start the fight. They, the poor, peaceful natives, who only wanted to be part of the celebration will be forced to fight back to protect their women and children. Racist, violent Caledonia will be portrayed as just that.
Sunday night, the Baptist church had organized a church supper and entertainment. They had invited a Native Christian Band to provide the entertainment and felt it would be a sign of open hearts to invite the Mohawk Warriors. They did arrive in full camouflage with scarves. They sat and by the end of the entertainment seemed to be relaxed. After most of the congregation had left and there were only a few stragglers remaining, a warrior went up to the minister and told him what a great evening they had and what a lovely building the church was. He then told the minister that if there was anything that he felt emotionally attached to he should take it because they were going to take over the Church. He then saluted and left. The scanners are also picking up on communications that tells of a plan to immediately take over Notre Dame as soon as it closes. They feel that with most of the Canadian Army being deployed in Afghanistan, the most the army can come up with is 1500. They can beat that number with 1 hand tied behind their back. Also, that idiot, Monty Kwinter [ed. Monte Kwinter is Ontario's Minister of Public Safety and Security in Dalton McGuinty's Liberal government; Kwinter has a degree in fine arts], announcing that all was back to normal in Caledonia not only enraged us, but also enraged the warriors. Almost like a challenge. That's about it. Stay safe.
Stay tuned through this weekend.
Updates:
As I had hoped, I'm starting to get emails from others who are close to the events to help clarify the situation.
A person who attended the concert at the Baptist church has contacted me after contacting the pastor, and tells me that the pastor denies that a threat of a takeover was ever made.
Note that the church is behind the barricade on Argyle Street. Services have been held as worshippers have been let through the barricade.
So this party of the story could be relegated to the fevered imagination pile for now...
That still leaves the question of Notre Dame. The original email expects that people know these names. The Baptist Church is on Argyle Street at the intersection of Braemar Avenue. Notre Dame refers to the Catholic high school on Braemar, just 800 feet west of the Baptist Church.
That would put the school behind the Argyle Street barricade as well.
Today or tomorrow will be the last day of school. I guess we'll see if the takeover of the high school is a real plan.
More updates as I receive them.
Updates:
The church was behind the barricade, but is no longer. The Douglas Creek Estates development was immediately adjacent to the church, to the south and to the east.
The school is also not behind the barricade, but the development borders the school property on the south, and the access road to the development runs along the west side of the school. All the activity, the barricades, the Warrior flags -- everything can be seen from the school. Not good for the children, but perhaps a nice location to control, tactically speaking.
In any case, let's hope the intensity level drops over the next little while.
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1
Dalton McGuinty's "Peace in our time" buyout didn't placate anyone? Maybe if he shovels MORE money into the DCE coal furnace, this problem will go away. If this incident does happen, I'd love to see the Ontario government buy their way out of this one!
Posted by: at June 28, 2006 04:08 PM (x4k8S)
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Caledonia = shades of Clockwork Orange...
Posted by: tomax7 at June 28, 2006 06:33 PM (jHhd0)
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It will be interesting to see if any of these rumors turn out to be true. At least this scenario is much better than mine. BTW, have you heard that the Manitoba blockade has been called off http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060628.wblock0628/BNStory/National/home
Posted by: jgriffin at June 28, 2006 07:38 PM (aJ4E1)
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Canadians have grown complacent about the rule of law apparently. Liberal politicians routinely ignore it and nobody cares too much, so now even an insurgency is overlooked. Liberals can simply raise taxes and hand it over to other criminals because Liberals have grown used to criminal mis-use of tax dollars, it's no sweat off them - keeps them in power.
Posted by: philanthropist at June 28, 2006 07:47 PM (7pBiD)
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Thanks for the update Steve. Caledonia has seemed to fall out of the light in the media, not enough outrage among the leftist editors in our MSM. Guess PMSH was right.
I can't fathom what the homeowners on six line are feeling tonight. I know I would be armed and my family relocated.
The weak provincial government has no clue what it is to feel fear. Tucked safe in their gated communities they have completely lost touch. Caledonia is but a sideline to their afternoon brunch, something to be tucked away in their spineless pea brains while they enjoy their roast beef dinner and that shot of congnac before bed.
Posted by: Shere Khan at June 28, 2006 09:10 PM (GnwpT)
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It will be interesting to see if any of these rumors turn out to be true. At least this scenario is much better than mine. BTW, have you heard that the Manitoba blockade has been called off http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060628.wblock0628/BNStory/National/home
Posted by: jgriffin at June 28, 2006 09:17 PM (aJ4E1)
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Thanks for your help....
Posted by: skyclad at June 28, 2006 09:35 PM (+tAqK)
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What a shame. It seems strange up here in Peace River country. People here are just too busy working, gambling and getting drunk. The Mid-East War, all out war between Israel and the Arabs, and most frightening, Caledonia. None of it seems real. Natives up here work along side everyone else and when Big Oil moves into Native territory, it seems like everything is settled with a big fat cheque. Everyone wins. Maybe the hatred is just seething underneath all the prosperity.
Political Correctness will destroy everything the West has worked for. The consequences are frightening. Let's hope we can find the strength and courage to fight. Let's start with Naom Chomsky.
Posted by: Matt at June 28, 2006 11:49 PM (Efahv)
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I think that the homeowners on six line have the most to worry about now that the OPP has abrogated the security that has been paid for through taxation and by contract.
The next step by our "Proud and Honourable" warriors might very well be inviting them to be unwilling guests behind the barricades. This after all is generally a step taken by terrorists in an attempt to protect their own sorry a$$es.
Posted by: vieux loup at June 29, 2006 12:20 AM (e+lSi)
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The churches should realize they are just pawns when they reach out to outlaws. Ditto retired politicians expecting to be honest brokers in a negotiation. Groups like the Warriors own the "useful idiot" principle.
Warrior Society thugs "can beat that number [1500 properly trained soldiers] with 1 hand tied behind their back"?
[stage direction: picks self up off the floor, wipes tears from eyes, straightens face, suppresses further laughter]
Maybe if the government ties the army's hands behind its back, but not otherwise. Though, admittedly, the government has done that sort of thing before.
Posted by: Jim Whyte at June 29, 2006 09:09 AM (/WgcG)
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That comment about "most of the Canadian Army being tied up in Afghanistan... most is 1500" really made me laugh.
The Army is understrength. Many of the combat units in 1 Canadian Mechanized Brigade Group have been stripped to provide for the present deployment in Afghanistan.
But whoever made this statement forgets that Canada has two other brigades, one in Petawawa and one in Valcartier. In fact, 2 Brigade is forming a battlegroup to replace the present group in Afghanistan. They're undergoing predeployment training.
If it were to come to a crisis, the Army could (painfully, but nontheless successfully) send the 2200-strong Royal Canadian Regiment battlegroup that's been spinning up for Afghanistan down to deal with the standoff, while delaying the repatriation of the present Afghan deployment.
As for handling them with one hand tied behind their backs? Well, the RCR battlegroup's been preparing for combat with the Taliban in Afghanistan. They're getting the same training that the PPCLI now in Afghanistan had, covering counter-insurgency warfare, civil affairs, fighting in built-up areas, and unconventional warfare - a skill-set highly applicable to any crisis in Caledonia. Add to that the benefits of all the combat lessons learned in Afghanistan and passed back to Canada - and just ask the Taliban how they're handling the PPCLI battlegroup there with "one hand tied behind their backs." I just read that Taliban forces in the Canadian area of operations just split because half of them don't want to fight anymore. These are Afghans who have been fighting Soviets, Northern Alliance, Americans, and now us - and for the natives to compare their military prowess to the Taliban is ridiculous.
And, on top of all that, the Army could probably scrape up another couple thousand regular troops from the 5ieme Brigade in Quebec. Not at the same level of training, but most of those troops have recent experience in Afghanistan. Furthermore, that's the same brigade that handled the Oka crisis - their senior officers and NCOs will remember that deployment and have four or five tours in Bosnia and Afghanistan to top that off. They can't be dismissed lightly.
And if 5000 well-trained and well-equipped, highly experienced regular troops isn't enough, the Army could call up several hundred reservists to help. These could cordon off the area of operations, do traffic control, provide medical and communications assistance, and do other echelon tasks, thus freeing up the regular troops to deal directly with the "enemy." And if attacked, these are still trained and armed soldiers - they'd give a good account of themselves.
Such a deployment would be very difficult, tremendously expensive, and hard on troops and equipment. It would be a nightmare from a planning and coordination perspective on short notice. But it could be done - and has been done in the past.
Posted by: Jeff Jones at June 29, 2006 01:16 PM (6M51a)
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Wow It's like our own little Fallujah
I doubt McQuinty will be disturbed this holiday weekend. He'll be kicking back somewhere with nary a thought in his head. ( As usual)
Posted by: Levesque at June 29, 2006 02:44 PM (De77y)
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It would be a shame if the Caledonia crisis came to military confrontation..........WHAT AM I SAYING?? I sincerely HOPE it DOES come to that, and yesterday is not soon enough. Terrorists are terrorists, be they Muslims or Indians. Both should be treated the same. Swift and ruthlessly.
Posted by: arctic_front at June 29, 2006 03:19 PM (YGvLW)
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I find these comments not very well informed. The Haudenosaunee/Six Nations have a valid claim to the lands, but Canada's land claims process moves too slowly, as reported recently by the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs.
I find it disgusting that you are advocating large scale violence against a race of people, when you don't have your facts straight.
Posted by: saga at June 30, 2006 08:48 PM (ae3LI)
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July 3rd, the sun has risen, beautiful day, the mosquitoes are biting, arrg.
Glad to hear/see nothing came of Caledia, been camping all weekend so missed my blogfix.
His mercies are new every morning, new every morning...
Posted by: tomax7 at July 03, 2006 07:16 AM (jHhd0)
Posted by: tomax7 at July 03, 2006 07:17 AM (jHhd0)
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Saga: The Haudenosaunee/Six Nations have never had a valid claim to these lands beyond what the deed from the crown provided. Lands in question were originally held by the Ojibway, and provided by them to the crown for Six Nations use. Your own ancestors gave them up for profit. Get over it. If you want to go after ancestral land, wander down to New York state and see what you can do.
Posted by: Skip at July 03, 2006 10:49 AM (PB37v)
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I'm not aboriginal, I'm a supporter. The 1841 'surrender' of the lands is "unlawful" by UN rules. The Haudenosaunee/Six Nations know that as they are well informed and follow all relevant laws and legal precedents.Canada can play the litigation game for years and cost taxpayers million$, but the outcome will be the same: They have a valid claim to the Haldimand deed and lands must be returned or compensated. Since this is a burial ground, they want it back. If the government would act now in good faith, this situation could end, and future situations like this could be avoided, not to mention saving million$ in legal fees!
The Haudenosaunee are peaceful unless attacked or invaded. If the OPP had done their job right from the beginning, there would have been no road blockades. The OPP have to uphold the SuprememCourt of Canada ruling that aboriginals pursuing land claims issues are not to be removed like common criminals. The reason for this ruling is that Canada is so far behind in dealing with legitimate land claims that aboriginals are forced into civil protest to guard their lands fromm desecration.
Posted by: saga at July 03, 2006 07:49 PM (ae3LI)
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...and there was NEVER any compensation given to Six Nations for the land surrendered. No one profited because the government just ignored them and took the land, against, I might add, Canada's existing laws at the time.
I like to address misinformation when I find it, and there is plenty here!
Posted by: saga at July 03, 2006 07:54 PM (ae3LI)
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How is this for real information. The indian lost over a hundred years ago. Get used to it.
Posted by: FREE at July 03, 2006 09:24 PM (e2wvr)
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"...and there was NEVER any compensation given to Six Nations for the land surrendered..."
Hokie, let's pay 6 nations for the land at 1812 rates. Oh not fair you say, ok, pay back all the government support, residential schools, free medicare, schooling, community centres, water treatment plants, combines and tractors, free free and more free things for the past 50 years in leu of it.
Or we can call all this even and move on?
Posted by: tomax7 at July 04, 2006 03:33 PM (jHhd0)
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No, we can't just "call it all even and move on". Given all of the hand-wringing about Respect For The Rule of Law I have seen around here, I'd expect we'd all be a little more sensitized to the need to do things in a lawful way. The law doesn't provide for "calling it all even".
The claims have to be dealt with, lawfully and fairly, and if the federal government would shelve its delay tactics once and for all and invest in getting these settled, we actually would be able to put things like this behind us all, and move on.
Posted by: Craigers at July 04, 2006 04:31 PM (W84zn)
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Incidentally, me and the family took in the fireworks in Caledonia on Saturday night. Peaceful night, no trouble that I could see (not even rowdy kids), good time had by all. Lots of folks from the reserve were also out to enjoy the fireworks.
Posted by: Craigers at July 04, 2006 04:35 PM (W84zn)
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Ken Hill is on the run, and other rumours
I've received an interesting email from someone who in turn cannot vouch for the accuracy of the email, other than to say he trusts the source.
Keep that in mind.
We're talking here about events in Caledonia, where native protesters have taken control of a land development. I have written extensively about a potential alternative explanation of why this is happening, something beyond merely a land claim.
I'm posting this email with this warning about accuracy because I can't think of a way to confirm any of the allegations, other than to put it out there and see if I get any response from potential witnesses to these alleged events who are also readers of this blog.
So here goes:
Subject: Trouble At DCE [ed. "DCE" stands for the "Douglas Creek Estates"]
I was at a group discussion this a.m. and I can attest to the reliability of my source, as reliable as one can be without having been actually present at the events I will relate.
Apparently Kenny Hill's HumV was torched and he and his Russian mistress are on the run. "Hill On The Run" to be sung to the tune of "Man On The Run". This can only mean 1 thing. Kenny was funding the DCE from day 1. If he's been torched, it could only have been the Mohawk Warriors. To piss them off, he must have refused further funding.
Drugs, booze and guns are now openly used at DCE. There has been 1 confirmed rape and 3 unconfirmed rapes. There are daily fights. Most recently a huge native woman, perhaps in her 40's, was bitch slapping a younger man and screaming at him to get the "fuck" out of her house. They're fighting over the homes! I love it!
Did any of you notice yesterday a large aircraft, approximately the size of a passenger jet, flying straight over town? That was a USA spy plane specially equipped to take pictures of bunkers, ammunition holdings, well you get the picture. This was not a jet that had taken off or was landing at Mt. Hope [ed. Mount Hope is the location of Hamilton’s international airport]. It made several passes over DCE and then shot up into the sky! It would only be here with permission and permission would only be given if our politicians didn't acknowledge this is not just a warm and fuzzy, peaceful protest by moccasin wearing, bead stringing natives! This is war!
There's a lot there to process. First, the idea that Ken Hill has had a falling out with some violent faction in the reserve. If true, it is speculation about whether it was about further funding, or if some other motive is involved.
That chaos rules behind the barricades does not surprise me, if true. The protest has been about lawlessness in the face of a Liberal government unwilling to impose law and order. I'm not sure what other outcome could be expected.
Spy planes? Well, I have to wonder, if only because there are smaller reconnaissance aircraft that could be used instead of something the size of a passenger jet. But then the person who wrote the email is probably not a trained observer. Still, seems like a bit of a stretch...at least I hope so. The implications are quite scary.
And talking about scary, I received a compliment from my correspondent:
I especially like your Blog, as it doesn't bow to the gods of political correctness, like our mainstream media. Having lived in this area my entire life, I admire you for taking on the likes of Ken Hill, as people around here (and on Six Nations) have not done so in fear of their safety.
In fear of their safety?! Should I be nervous?
Posted by: Steve Janke at
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Well Steve, I don't know about spy planes but a 4 engine Orion flew over Ancaster a couple days ago. Couldn't tell if it was Canadian Forces or not, but by the long boom out the back it was definetly an Orion.
Could have been taking pictures, for sure. Ancaster is a long way from the ocean, and the Orion is usually a submarine hunter.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 28, 2006 04:20 PM (nAMT1)
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It was probably just visiting the Canadian Warplane Heritage Museum, I'd assume. We see military planes around here all the time. Of course, you never know...
Posted by: Craigers at June 28, 2006 04:56 PM (W84zn)
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About your safety, I wondered about that the first time you started blogging about the likes of Ken Hill. Rather an unsavoury lot.
Posted by: Ben at June 28, 2006 06:24 PM (D2c8R)
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Concerning your safety, I wondered about that the first time you started blogging about the likes of Ken Hill. Rather an unsavoury lot.
Posted by: Ben at June 28, 2006 06:27 PM (D2c8R)
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Wasn't Ken Hill arrested by the OPP last week?
Posted by: CERDIP at June 28, 2006 10:30 PM (Da4+2)
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I witnessed the plane fly over.
It approached from the east (Niagara Falls AFB??) and after going over Caledonia at an estimated 3000 to 4000 feet; it applied full power and climbed quickly. It confused me at first because it had 4 jet engines and they were smaller diameter ones like the old Boeing 707’s. It was obviously not a passenger plane like an Airbus that can have 4 engines, but those have engines that are larger diameter. It was also not a ‘wide-body’ airliner. I believe it was one of these planes.
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=120
“The aircraft is a modified WC-135B. The OC-135B modifications center around four cameras installed in the rear of the aircraft. Since its primary mission is to take pictures, most of the installed equipment and systems provide direct support to the cameras and the camera operator.”
Posted by: SickandTired at June 29, 2006 11:06 AM (DDEvT)
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This is pure nonsense. I don't suppose it has occurred to anyone that this is summer, entering the height of the air show season, and any number of airframes based on the 707 (i.e. KC-135, OC-135, WC-135, RC-135) will be flying all over North America doing nothing more sinister than heading to podhunk airfields across the continent to sit on static display for a couple of days.
Posted by: Chris Taylor at June 30, 2006 09:46 AM (H0lcY)
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"Drugs, booze and guns are now openly used at DCE."
There are no guns booze or alcohol allowed at the reclamation site. If there were guns, the police would have killed someone by now!
"Wasn't Ken Hill arrested by the OPP last week?"
Yes, he was, so this is another piece of malicious fiction.
Posted by: saga at July 01, 2006 12:27 PM (ae3LI)
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You guys are a bunch of fucking computer hacking fagot crackers why don't you go get a life instead of jacking off in front of a computer 24/7 stirring up propaganda with your unconfirmed he said she said bullshit!
Posted by: at July 05, 2006 02:09 AM (R4nxU)
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Who is MP Brent St Denis backing for the Liberal leadership?
I wonder who Brent St Denis is backing?
In case you are not up on your cast of Liberal MPs, Brent St Denis is the member of parliament for Algoma-Manitoulin-Kapuskasing. He has been an MP since 1993.
As far as I can tell he has not indicated which candidate for the Liberal leadership he is supporting.
You might wonder why I should care. Well, the reason I'm wondering is because it looks like one of his staffers was the one who created the "pubnight" PDF file announcing the Stephane Dion fundraiser that has been a topic of discussion.
The staffer is stdenb0@parl.gc.ca (the MP's account is StDenB, and his staffers are assigned the numbered email addresses 0 through 9, which is the standard way email addresses are created on the Hill, as far as I can figure).
The author of the PDF file is "stdenb0" -- there really is no other interpretation of that name.
Of course, individual Liberals can support whoever they choose. But if Mr St Denis is supporting, say, Michael Ignatieff over Stephane Dion, he might prefer that his staffers do their work on the Dion campaign more discreetly. It wouldn't do to have "StDenB" attached to Dion material.
On the other hand, Mr St Denis might be an undeclared Dion supporter. In that case, having his staff scribble up posters to help out Bryon Wilfert's staffer with the spam email and the big shindig fundraiser would be appropriate. Remember that Wilfert is a declared member of the Dion leadership team.
Yes, that would be entirely appropriate.
Well, except for the whole spam thing. And using government resources for fundraising.
Posted by: Steve Janke at
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So I gather that you no longer have a problem with using government email accounts for political purposes?
Posted by: Jason Cherniak at June 28, 2006 02:42 PM (x2okw)
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St. Denis is supporting Kennedy.
http://www.huntsvilleforester.com/1151503284/
"St. Denis introduced Kennedy, pledging his support for the Toronto MPP. "
Posted by: Bailey at June 28, 2006 04:28 PM (pYHpB)
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St. Denis has been backing Kennedy for a long time.
Posted by: Justin Tetreault at June 28, 2006 10:38 PM (icuVO)
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maybe St. Denis should be looking for a new staffer to fill the 0 email address out for two reasons. 1) his/her differences politically and 2)his/her use of government email for spam purposes
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 29, 2006 10:28 AM (Xiqvi)
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Stephane Dion's fundraising email: A rebuttal
Jason Cherniak defends the parliamentary assistant and the use of a government email account to send out invitations to a fundraising even for Stephane Dion:
Email is free people!
Tonight was the Dion fundraiser in Toronto. It is the first time that I have been involved in organizing such a thing and I was quite happy with the result. Dion did well, we had great attendance and I enjoyed the celebration that followed. I even learned that a former cabinet minister in attendance (not Dion) used to babysit my mother!
At the moment, though, I am pissed off. It is because I just read this crock of $#!@. I am sick and tired of politically minded people pretending to be "Angry" because of completely meaningless tripe. Who the hell cares if an Ottawa staffer sends a political email from a Parliamentary account. For godssake; they work for POLITICIANS. Of course they are going to send political emails!
[Note that the fundraiser Jason attended is different from the one refered to in the email being debated here. Thanks to Jason for the correction.]
If you recall, I opened my post with a comment that I am also not concerned about a trivial email here or there.
But there's more:
For the record, I have not discussed this with my MP and he will make his own decision of what to do. However, if I were an MP I would insist that staffers use their parliamentary accounts for all political emails. I would then go out and defend this policy against those who are inane enough to complain.
In my posting, I left out the "To" list because I wasn't interested in where the email was going, just where it was coming from. But maybe that was a mistake.
This was not an email to one or two or a dozen people, each of them a personal acquaintance of the staffer in question, each being asked if they had planned to go to the event, so maybe they should meet somewhere and head out together, ya-da ya-da.
This was an email sent to a series of official distributions lists containing literally hundreds of names:
To: - SEN SENATORS' OFF/BUR. SENATEURS
To: - BQ DePUTeS/MEMBERS
To: - BQ: ADJOINTS
To: - CONSERVATIVE ASSISTANTS CONSERVATEURS
To: - CONSERVATIVE MEMBERS/DePUTeS CONSERVATEURS
To: - INDEPENDENT MEMBERS/DePUTeS INDePENDANTS
To: - LIBERAL ASSISTANTS
To: - LIBERAL MEMBERS/DePUTeS
To: - NDP MEMBERS/DePUTeS NPD
To: - NDP/NPD ASSISTANTS
Every MP. Every Senator. Every assistant. Every party was tagged.
Hundreds and hundreds of emails. Each with a 50KB PDF file attached.
Each received an impersonal email from someone almost all of them did not know, asking them to give money (it did not explicitly say that, but it did say it was identified as a leadership campaign event).
There is a name for this sort of email. It's called spam. Even if you accept that parliamentary accounts could be used for partisan purposes (and I have no problems with individual and personal communications), it should not be used to spam Parliament Hill. It's not just in poor taste, it could be considered illegal.
In retrospect, maybe I needed to be clearer on this. I did say everybody got this email, but then I wasn't all that precise.
I mean everybody got this email.
Spam should not be tolerated. Partisan political spam originating from inside the government itself especially.
Jason thinks this should not just be tolerated, but encouraged! That is wrong. It has the potentially of dramatically decreasing the signal-to-noise ratio of intergovernmental communications. Valuable messages are missed in the clutter as Liberal leadership candidates spam away. The more moribund the candidate, the more frantic the spamming. Angry recipients demanding their names be removed from official distribution lists. Network slowdowns, especially if someone does a mass mailing of a huge PDF or graphics image. Viruses inadvertantly being delivered to every account. Email might be free to the person sending it, Jason, but there is a cost to deal with spam for those who are inundated by it.
Posted by: Steve Janke at
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Your initial post certainly seemed to be about "misuse" of parliamentary accounts for political purposes. If your real complaint is about spam, then I have some sympathy. Perhaps the recall attempt was because the email was not meant to be sent to so many people.
Also, to be clear, I was at a fundraiser in TO that I was organizing last night. I know nothing about the Ottawa get together.
In any case, my argument still stands - it makes little difference if an email is sent from a work account instead of a personal account.
Posted by: Jason Cherniak at June 28, 2006 09:08 AM (BjOjj)
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Your initial post certainly seemed to be about "misuse" of parliamentary accounts for political purposes. If your real complaint is about spam, then I have some sympathy. Perhaps the recall attempt was because the email was not meant to be sent to so many people.
Also, to be clear, I was at a fundraiser in TO that I was organizing last night. I know nothing about the Ottawa get together.
In any case, my argument still stands - it makes little difference if an email is sent from a work account instead of a personal account.
Posted by: at June 28, 2006 09:10 AM (BjOjj)
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Spam is a misuse, of course. The rules are very draconian, probably because the boundary between an innocuous email and a spam blast my be difficult to pin down. Let's say you assign a number -- 50 or more constitutes spam. Then everyone will break their email lists to blocks of 49.
So the rule is simple -- no partisan political emails using government accounts. So simple I'm surprised that someone would break it.
But then some cynics might say that this is typical of the Liberals. From this email to the Sponsorship Scandal, they just don't seem to get it -- the government, its resources, and its money are not their personal property to be used, misused, and squandered as they see fit.
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 28, 2006 09:21 AM (pFrk8)
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Okay Cherniak.
In any case, my argument still stands - it makes little difference if an email is sent from a work account instead of a personal account.
So a few million was stolen...dese tings will happen.
OR
...a proof is a proof if it's a good proof den it will be proven........
Pick one.
Syncro
Posted by: Syncrodox at June 28, 2006 09:58 AM (azwV2)
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The idea that email is free is, well, idiotic. Just because one doesn't get charged a per use fee doesn't mean a service is free. Providing email service to parliament requires a vast network of hardware and software which costs millions of dollars every year to maintain. This is probably a good investment for the country as it facilitates timely and accurate communications.
While one extra email sent to everyone on the hill may not "tax" the system appreciably, the law recognizes that unfettered personal use will eventually result in higher maintenance costs and/or lower effectiveness for the purpose for which it was installed. THAT'S WHY THERE'S A LAW!!!!
Of course, laws regarding misuse of public resources don't apply to liberals any more than laws regarding protection of citizens and property apply to Ontario natives. Learning these nuances of Canadian jurisprudence will help us all in comprehending when, and when not, to apply the rule of law.
Posted by: Rob R at June 28, 2006 10:04 AM (y9Fs6)
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Just a few questions in regards to "free" and "misuse":
1) Was the email sent out during normal government business hours?
2) Was the person sending out the email part of Dion's parliamentary staff? Or was this person hired seperately out of Dion's own campaign expense acount?
3) Was the email sent out using computer systems owned by the Government of Canada? Or was the computer system purchased by Dion's campaign?
4) Is the campaign being run out of a government office? Or is it being run out of space being rented by Dion's campaign?
As you can see, there are other questions about what is exactly "free"... whether it be if the govenrment of Canada is paying the person sending out the email, or whether Dion's campaign headquarters is a government office in order to offset his campaign costs (i.e. hydro, office rental expenses) or whether the equipment being used for the campaign is government owned and thus the time used to operate the equipment is detracting from time that could be spent on government business...
Wes, email itself is free; everything else associated with it is not. If we could get answers on these questions, then we would know whether or not Dion is abusing his parliamentary expenses to run a campaign.
We already know the email is going out of a parliamentary account. I have high doubts Dion has set up an entirely new computer system in a different office with new staff members and redundantly linked it all back to his parliamentary office... it is possible, but highly unlikely. And if that is the case, then it isn't free.
Posted by: Surecure at June 28, 2006 10:16 AM (+tET0)
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Just a few questions in regards to "free" and "misuse":
1) Was the email sent out during normal government business hours?
2) Was the person sending out the email part of Dion's parliamentary staff? Or was this person hired seperately out of Dion's own campaign expense acount?
3) Was the email sent out using computer systems owned by the Government of Canada? Or was the computer system purchased by Dion's campaign?
4) Is the campaign being run out of a government office? Or is it being run out of space being rented by Dion's campaign?
As you can see, there are other questions about what is exactly "free"... whether it be if the govenrment of Canada is paying the person sending out the email, or whether Dion's campaign headquarters is a government office in order to offset his campaign costs (i.e. hydro, office rental expenses) or whether the equipment being used for the campaign is government owned and thus the time used to operate the equipment is detracting from time that could be spent on government business...
Wes, email itself is free; everything else associated with it is not. If we could get answers on these questions, then we would know whether or not Dion is abusing his parliamentary expenses to run a campaign.
We already know the email is going out of a parliamentary account. I have high doubts Dion has set up an entirely new computer system in a different office with new staff members and redundantly linked it all back to his parliamentary office... it is possible, but highly unlikely. And if that is the case, then it isn't free.
And as has already been mentioned, there is a little question about something referred to as the law. Yeah, that might be important or something.
Posted by: Surecure at June 28, 2006 10:27 AM (+tET0)
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Anyone who thinks email is free is an ignorant fool. Period.
Posted by: djb at June 28, 2006 12:30 PM (FteTO)
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The event wasn't a fundraising event. It was a political gathering. People have political gatherings on Parliament Hill all the time. People get invited to "Liberal" events, "Conservative" events, and even "leadership" events. It is a political place. Everyone on Parliament Hill gets emails from other people inviting them to go to political events. Every day. Everyone who works for an MP is a POLITICAL assistant. These are not public servants.
Posted by: Harry at June 28, 2006 12:49 PM (zPXt7)
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Too many words expended on a mistake. Fun to surface and flail briefly, but that's it. What's the latest weak-kneed government response to the Caledonia protesters?
Posted by: angryinthecornbelt at June 28, 2006 01:06 PM (0p4xh)
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Jason seems to be as ethically challenged as the Liberal Party.
1) Why is a parliamentary assistant working for both Dion the MP and Dion the Leadership Candidate. How do the people of Canada and especially Dion consituents know that he is not getting paid by the MP and working for the Leadership Candidate?
2) How do we know the Government of Canada resources are not aiding the candidate in his personal business?
It is not the E-mail, it is the ethics.
Posted by: dkjones at June 28, 2006 02:02 PM (ClxyY)
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Ethics--Liberals--not to be used in the same sentence! Surecure--you have asked exactly the right questions--but there will be no answers--a Liberal does not see any conflict in this--after all, what is theirs is theirs and what is ours is theirs. I can see it all now--the next Liberal spin--we didn't know about adscam money--we get so many emails that we don't really pay attention!
Thanks for this Angry--now I am angry all over again.
Posted by: George at June 28, 2006 02:53 PM (ZA6J6)
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Um,
Is this about email or about organizing a Liberal leadership campaign out of the tax payer's pocket? If Wilfert was working on his own time I have no issues, No additional cost was born by the tax payer. If Wilfert was organizing a Liberal leadership campaign when he (she?) was supposed to be about government business, this I have a problem with.
Posted by: jgriffin at June 28, 2006 04:40 PM (aJ4E1)
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Not only do we not know whether the staffer was working for the Dion campaign on taxpayer time, but if this large file was sent to hundreds of people over taxpayer bandwidth, then what genuine government correspondance was held up in the pipeline? And how much time was wasted by the hundreds of recipients in opening and deleting or replying to this email?
Posted by: Andrew Spencer at June 28, 2006 07:25 PM (p1agh)
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It seems to me than when you have a job and are paid by someone (in this case the government) you do the governments work. E-mailing, or phone so;icitation or letter writng on behalf of a leadershgip candidate is NOT government work.
So perhaps the send the e-mail on thier lunch hour. Then they should do it from home. The ogernment didn't put in internet hook ups so employees and do thier personal stuff from work.
But then agian it is the liberals party-the most corrupt, dishonest, disreputable political organization anywhere. Reading Jason Cherniak just reminds me of all the reasons we don't want the liberals ever again. He thinks its OK for Volpe to get money from children, he thinks it OK for Graham to do his "thing", and he thinks this spam stuff is OK. He makes a "perfect" liberal.
On the other hand Calgary Grit at least has some ethics. He's in the wrong party, mind you but he seems honerable.
Horny Toad
Posted by: Horny Toad at June 28, 2006 08:19 PM (Lq4bO)
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Hey Steve,
As someone who actually administers IT systems within the .gc.ca domain, there are a few minor details that Mr. Cherniak appears to be either willfully ignorant of, or merely blissfully unaware. The first is the Treasury Board of Canada's Policy on the use of Electronic Networks - a nice little document that outlines what is considered to be appropriate use of any electronic network operated by the Government of Canada. Last time I checked, anything with a .gc.ca domain suffix kind of falls under this category, and sending out large volumes of unsolicited e-mail kind of falls under the category of unacceptable useage.
The second thing he seems to forget is that all those little electrons do not just automagically appear in his (or anyone else's) e-mail box...they travel over this little thing called infrastructure - you know, servers (MS Exchange single server Enterprise edition license $2600ish/per + 3000/per server for base MS server o/s, + 10K per box that it resides on), switches (don't get me started, but you're looking at roughly 5k per switch and most sites have multiple switches), Routers (variable, but again you're talking fairly large dollars), and the various bits of disaster recovery, security and anti-virus protection associated with each system. Oh, yes, I also forgot the additional $350ish/per seat for an Office Application suite, and if you're talking about Adobe Acrobat, add in another $500 right there. Oh yeah, I also forgot that depending on who is actually providing the infrastructure (Bell, Telus, etc) data is charged by frame.
Also, these systems also do not run themselves - that's where people like me come in. That is how 'free' e-mail is. They may be 'Political' Assistants, but it doesn't change the fact that it is 'Government' infrastructure and that they are as subject to the rules governing its use as anyone else. I have taken political staff to task on systems abuses and security violations after they have been given fair warning about these policies and standards. My responsibilities are ultimately to the taxpayers of Canada, not some politically connected staffer.
Posted by: Sylia at June 28, 2006 09:24 PM (Ve5WF)
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Personally, I'd just add 2+2 together to figure this out...
1) From an entry on Jason Cherniak's own blog from Monday, May 01, 2006 (I did my own research), when he threw his support behind Dion, we know that Bryon Wilfert is Dion's caucus liaison. I'd say that makes him Parliamentary staff.
2) The email was sent at 1:46 in the afternoon, during regular business hours and well after the standard lunch hour.
3) The email was sent via a government email address.
I think this is a pretty open and shut case, don't you think?
Posted by: Surecure at June 28, 2006 10:03 PM (5xF7M)
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Uh uh. It's not just that a staffer send the note around by email -- it's that he was doing it on company time. Party business should not be run out of government offices...this then amounts to campaign spending, which must be disclosed under the elections act.
Posted by: david maclean at June 29, 2006 12:21 AM (lQ+Qv)
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Steve, why has no one taken into account the most expensive part of this spam from Dion's leadership bid?
How many man hours were spent reading the email on government time when it showed up to their government email boxes?
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 29, 2006 10:23 AM (Xiqvi)
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So many transgressions, and speaking of conventions.. costs .. unreported donations.
Commenters on http://CalgaryGrit.blogspot.com were grasping at the tiny straw of conservatives not registering donations of 1.7 $million.
The only part of that 1.7 in contention is the profit after convention costs are paid out.
Pretty slim straw to grasp at, yet they went for it to their sad demise.
Have a look to the comment thread end. I am ashamed that I rubbed their noses into some heavy dirt, but I couldn*t stop myself. Cackle! TG
Posted by: TonyGuitar at June 30, 2006 09:14 AM (2GVBQ)
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That*s under June 28th post **Karma**. TG
Posted by: TonyGuitar at June 30, 2006 09:22 AM (2GVBQ)
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Jason is right- Liberals are entitled to their entitlements. No further discussion is necessary.
Posted by: Mac at July 03, 2006 08:20 PM (TaDbz)
Posted by: micheal at July 05, 2006 07:56 PM (4jB9D)
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June 27, 2006
Stephane Dion using government resources for leadership campaign [update]
The debate continues, with Jason Cherniak defending the email, and my response.
I'll be the first to say that I sometimes wonder if something as innocuous as an email is really something to get upset about. But the rules are clear, and while one email might seem like nothing, it could easily become hundreds, thousands, even hundreds of thousands of emails -- so I suppose the rules make sense.
The rule I'm talking about is the one that forbids government employees from using their email accounts for political partisan reasons. A typical government email address is "@parl.gc.ca". These addresses are assigned to MPs and their assistants and are to be used to help in their work on behalf of their constituents.
Bryon Wilfert is the Liberal MP for Richmond Hill. He is also the caucus liason for Stephane Dion, one of the candidates for the leadership of the Liberal Party. One of Wilfert's assistants sent this email out using his or her parliamentary email account:
From: Wilfert, Bryon - Assistant 1
Sent: June 27, 2006 1:46 PM
To: ...
Subject: THUNDEROUS THURSDAY
Please join the Stephane Dion Campaign for an evening of fun at The Brig Pub (23 York St. - ByWard Market) this Thursday, June 29th from 5pm- 7pm. Our special guest will be the Hon. Don Boudria.
We're calling it: "Your Boss is Away… Come out to Play!"
I've cut out the "To" field because I don't think it's fair for people to be drawn into this just because they received an email. Suffice it to say, however, that just about everybody got this email.
So "Thunderous Thursday" is not a party hosted by Stephane Dion. It is being hosted by the Stephane Dion Campaign. That's important. This is a partisan Liberal leadership event. Don Boudria is a former Liberal MP who is now a senior associate at the public relations agency Hill & Knowlton. He is also a senior member of the Stephane Dion leadership committee.
And check out the flyer. See the big Stephane Dion logo? You'll see it in the upper right-hand corner of every page of Stephane Dion's leadership website.
This is not the first time this has happened, as we see in this story from Stephen Taylor. In that case, very similar to this one, the staffer apologized (sort of).
You might think this isn't a big deal. But this was a mass mailing for a leadership campaign event. It sure seems like Stephane Dion is letting his caucus liason MP Bryon Wilfert use his taxpayer-funded parliamentary resources (both the assistant and the email account) as Dion's personal fundraising tools.
I guess the Liberal leadership candidates really are hard up for cash. So much so that they're willing to do really dumb things to get their hands on any.
[And in case you were wondering, I got this information via a recipient, who in turn got in touch with me via a personal non-government account. He understands the rules.]
Update: Literally moments after posting, I received word that this assistant had sent out a "recall" message. Uh, too late. I think we deserve an explanation about how the rules apply to Stephane Dion's campaign.
Posted by: Steve Janke at
04:41 PM
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Post contains 517 words, total size 4 kb.
1
This reminded me of something I read on a liberal blog awhile back:
Policy Watch.
One need not throw stones in glass houses, especially when Rob Anders is under investigation for the very same thing, devoting a staffer to Stevie's Leadership campaign.
Steve
Kanter On Politics
Posted by: Steve Kantor at June 27, 2006 06:27 PM (2qO2y)
2
It's typical of liberals, they have and always will, consider government resources as their own.
It doesn't matter whether they are in power or in opposition, it's part and parcel of their view, that liberals are entitled to their entitlements.
Posted by: William at June 27, 2006 08:10 PM (W1+de)
3
"It doesn't matter whether they are in power or in opposition, it's part and parcel of their view, that liberals are entitled to their entitlements."
Well since as we've seen conservatives are doing the exact same sort of thing, it probably doesn't say anything about liberals at all. It probably says - quite accurately - that increasingly the lines between politics and government are becoming hard to draw and hard to see.
It would take an incredible amount of arrogance to see one mistake (yes, definitely a mistake) made by a political staffer and use it to condemn a whole group of people with a political viewpoint opposite to mine.
Posted by: Craigers at June 27, 2006 09:09 PM (W84zn)
4
The public threshold of tolerance with respect to Liberal shenanigans / corruption / outright flaunting of the law (I'm looking at you Volpe) is so high at this point that I'm certain this item will not register so much as a blip on the radar of national consiousness.
Btw, good point by William and well stated besides.
Posted by: Brad in Waterloo at June 27, 2006 09:13 PM (bfEFg)
5
Craigers said: "It would take an incredible amount of arrogance to see one mistake...."
Um, ONE MISTAKE? lmao. Yeah, one mistake. Just one lonely oopsies. This is obviously a totally isolated incident. We're all shocked. Totally floored. Who would have ever anticipated that news of an ethical indescression would emerge from the Liberal camp of all places. Well holy shmoly...
Please excuse me while I shuffle off to dispense with the shattered remnants of my "arrogance."
Posted by: Brad in Waterloo at June 27, 2006 09:23 PM (bfEFg)
6
"This is obviously a totally isolated incident."
It's not? What's the link, other than some supposed pathological immorality that affects liberals?
Are all the instances of Conservative wrongdoing somehow connected as well? Can I link Gurmant Grewal to Rob Anders in five steps or less? Come on.
That kind of paranoia is
so much opposition thinking.
Posted by: Craigers at June 27, 2006 10:01 PM (W84zn)
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Dion's campaign really needs to start building some bridges to Volpe. Afterall it's all about "integrity."
Syncro
P.S. I wonder how Cherniak will spin this?? Should be funny!!!!
Posted by: Syncrodox at June 27, 2006 11:30 PM (azwV2)
8
This NOT an error by a political staffer it is an error by a long time Liberal MP who should know better. Byron Wilfert is out of his depth in Federal politics. He should have stuck to his Richmond Hill municipal ward.
Posted by: Mel N at June 27, 2006 11:57 PM (9EKXO)
9
Who gives a flying... ?
For my full response, please see my blog.
Posted by: Jason Cherniak at June 28, 2006 12:39 AM (Aenn0)
10
No, really, Stephane Dion sucks.
Posted by: morison at June 28, 2006 12:41 AM (DRtQx)
11
Who organizes an event at The Brig? It's not exactly a top-shelf selection. (Don't get me wrong: it's not bottom shelf; it's just not where The Beautiful People usually enjoy being seen.)
And apparently Cherniak doesn't realize that emails coming from federal Government email accounts bear the imprimateur of, well, the federal Government.
Posted by: Paul O at June 28, 2006 01:14 AM (isLIk)
12
Yawn. This is the most annoying form of 'gotcha politics'.
Big flippin' deal. You've never used your work email for personal use? Don't give me the old 'it's the principle' crap, either. If this is the best untoward act you can come up with to 'get' the Liberals with, well, it's sad.
This stuff makes me embarassed to consider myself a Conservative supporter, really.
Stick to the Caledonia story you've been working on - at least there seems to be a modicum of scandal there...
Posted by: KM at June 28, 2006 08:22 AM (UBh/D)
13
PS - I can't believe I agree with Cherniak... (I think I hear the omnious clippity-clop of the hooves of what can only be the four horsemen of the Apocalypse...)
Posted by: KM at June 28, 2006 08:26 AM (UBh/D)
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Yeesh, talk about a big case of nuthin'. I can recall receiving Stephen Harper leadership emails from MPs and assistants supporting him too.
Posted by: at June 28, 2006 08:41 AM (pX18t)
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Yeesh, talk about a big case of nuthin'. I can recall receiving Stephen Harper leadership emails from MPs and assistants supporting him too. Wish I'd saved them!
Posted by: Mike at June 28, 2006 08:42 AM (pX18t)
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From: Ignatieff, Michael - Assistant 3
Sent: June 1, 2006 4:29 PM
To: - LIBERAL ASSISTANTS
Subject: MI Monday/les lundis de Michael - June 5th: Clock Tower Brew Pub
Please see the below invitation.
Veuillez trouver une invitation ci-jointe.
Jane Wisener
Special Assistant/Adjointe Spéciale
Michael Ignatieff
Member of Parliament for Etobicoke - Lakeshore
MICHAEL'S MONDAY
Come join your Ottawa Centre friends next Monday . . .
Discuss politics, network and socialize!
Date: Monday, June 5, 2006
Time: 5 - 7 p.m.
Place: The Clock Tower Brew Pub, 575 Bank Street (in the Glebe, just south of the Queensway)
Bring your friends!
Any questions, please contact:
Yasir Naqvi
ynaqvi@langmichener.ca
Tim Straka
timothy.straka@gmail.com
LES LUNDIS DE MICHAEL
Venez vous joindre avec vos amis d'Ottawa-Centre lundi prochain...
Discutez des politiques et venez socialiser avec nous!
Date : Le lundi 5 juin 2006
entre 17h et 19h.
Lieu : The Clock Tower Brew Pub, 575 rue Bank (dans le cartier Glebe, au sud de l'autoroute)
Invitez vos amis.
Pour vos questions, contactez
Yasir Naqvi
ynaqvi@langmichener.ca
Tim Straka
timothy.straka@gmail.com
Posted by: mike smith at June 28, 2006 08:51 AM (akQaM)
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I find all this hub-bub pathetically petty. Am I the only one who finds it obscene that Harper deliberately picks a fight with the media so that he can go on the "campaign" road to deliver his vote-buying messages - at "taxpayer" expense. His cabinet also holding press conferences in elaborate set-ups - at taxpayer expense. Can you imagine what this has cost Canadians so far for Harper's campaigning? I don't suppose he'd return the cost via the Conservative party for these campaign costs?
The email thing is pretty small I'd say in comparison.
You see, if Harper stayed on the good side of the media he'd could give press conferences in Ottawa with questions from reporters and save a whole lot of damn money couldn't he.
We've been had again by Mr. Strategy!
Posted by: Sandi at June 28, 2006 01:55 PM (AkZnB)
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There's an event at the Brigg? Thanks for letting me know. I'll be there for sure!
Posted by: Derek at June 28, 2006 02:25 PM (zXEKo)
19
From: Guergis, Helena - Assistant 1
Sent: Friday, November 25, 2005 2:53 PM
To: - SEN GLOBAL; - CONSERVATIVE MEMBERS/DÉPUTÉS CONSERVATEURS; - CONSERVATIVE ASSISTANTS CONSERVATEURS; - LIBERAL MEMBERS/DÉPUTÉS; - LIBERAL ASSISTANTS; - NDP MEMBERS/DÉPUTÉS NPD; - NDP/NPD ASSISTANTS; - NDP MEMBERS/DÉPUTÉS NPD; - NDP/NPD ASSISTANTS
Subject:
Staff, Members, Spouses; you're all invited
Invitation
You are invited to a Jewellery Party
Hosted By
Helena Guergis, MP
On Monday, November 28th, 2005
Spouses Lounge, Rm. 631-S Centre Block
From Noon to 6:00 p.m.
Enjoy Christmas Cheer, Snacks & Friendship.
Featuring Jewellery Designs by Yvonne Reynolds
Buy One Get One ½ Price
(Cash or Cheque Only)
Membres du personnel, députés, conjoints sont tous invités
Invitation
Vous êtes cordialement invités àune présentation de bijoux
organisée par
la députée Helena Guergis
Le lundi 28 novembre 2005
Salon des conjoints, salle 631-S Édifice du Centre
De midi à18 h
Venez vous amuser et grignoter entre amis àl’occasion des Fêtes.
Bijoux conçus par
Yvonne Reynolds
Achetez-en un obtenez-en un autre àmoitié prix
(Chèque ou comptant seulement)
Posted by: More Dave at June 28, 2006 04:15 PM (pX18t)
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June 26, 2006
Gambling profits and paramilitary parades
From the Hamilton Spectator (June
:
First Nations chiefs from across Ontario pledged their support to Caledonia protesters yesterday, and warned governments to expect more occupations if native land claims aren't settled.
The 100 chiefs arrived at Douglas Creek Estates on the eve of today's 100th day of the occupation.
They were bused in to provide moral support to protesters and to urge the federal and provincial governments to exercise caution.
Chiefs took turns issuing veiled threats of violence. However, the presence of the Chiefs was a coincidence:
The Caledonia dispute wasn't on the chiefs' agenda, but their hosts invited the delegates to visit the site. They were driven there in two large passenger buses.
With a colour party of flag bearers in military fatigues, the Ontario chiefs were led across the survey to the entrance of Douglas Creek Estates, for the impromptu press conference.
So what were the Chiefs doing on this reserve at this time if it was not to take part in paramilitary parades?
The Ontario chiefs had been attending a two-day conference at the Six Nations reserve, where they discussed the distribution of proceeds from Casino Rama.
Casino Rama is the Native-owned and -operated commercial casino near Orillia, Ontario.
The distribution of the proceeds to First Nations people is managed by the Ontario First Nations Limited Partnership. I saw a familiar name on the list of directors of the OFNLP:
Steve Williams --- Independent Director, Vice President
Steve Williams is also the name of the former chief of the Six Nations. That Steve Williams was also a member the Six Nations Council Gaming Commission, until he was fired for help business partners Ken Hill, Jerry Montour, and Art Montour set up an internet gaming licensing enterprise running out of the offices of their cigarette firm, Grand River Enterprises, behind the back of the Council firmly in opposition of the legally questionable operation.
I can't be sure it is the same Steve Williams, but my gut tells me it is. So on June 8, the chiefs come to discuss splitting up gambling profits. Coincidently they take a tour of the land the Ontario government is about to buy for the Six Nations as a response to violent protests and barricades. The vice president of the partnership in charge of managing those profits the chiefs were discussing just happens to be one of the main backers of having gambling on the Six Nations reserve. His business partner, also part of the same pro-gambling team, is on the barricades and gets arrested for assault, defending the land claim that was the subject of the chiefs' military parade.
But maybe it's all just a coincidence.
Just one more thing. The Ontario First Nations Limited Partnership has its address in Hagersville, Ontario. You might think they would be located near Casino Rama, near Orillia. But Orillia is almost three hours away. Find Hagersville on the map, and you find yet another amazing coincidence. Both Caledonia and Hagersville are on the borders of the Six Nations Reserve. It's about a 15 minute drive Route 6 to Caledonia from Hagersville -- a mere 10 miles apart. Hagersville butts up the southern corner of the reserve, while Caledonia butts up against the north-east corner. That's why I think we're dealing with the same Steve Williams. And that's another reason to wonder just how much gambling interests are connected to the events in and around the Six Nations reserve.
Posted by: Steve Janke at
10:18 AM
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1
The more I read this stuff the more angry I get! I don't have the words to describe the anger I am feeling now. All of Ontario is being bullied by these thugs and the province is just giving in! I especially love the comment "We will not be bullied by Canada's treaties" made by the chiefs. Well, if the chiefs don't want to honour the treaties then why should Canada?
This is not going to end well.
Posted by: jgriffin at June 26, 2006 01:39 PM (aJ4E1)
2
there is one simple way to redress the issue . . seeing how the government and the OPP are as usless as tits on a bull.
Boycott Casino Rama. For fun, throw up some roadblocks on the access highways. Dare the OPP to do something about it
Hit the criminals where it hurts . . in their wallets.
Posted by: Fred at June 26, 2006 03:32 PM (F3gAV)
3
But Fred, that would be RACIST y'know. Besides, the OPP would have everybody on the barricade in irons in 20 minutes.
That's kinda the problem here. Asymetric application of the law. The OPP isn't shy about pulling over white people, or arresting white people, or putting on riot gear and beating the hell out of white people.
Indians though, that's kid glove time. Frankly, I'm very curious as to why that is.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 26, 2006 04:31 PM (nAMT1)
4
Hmm. What might work better? Legalise online gambling. Nobody's going to do business with a dodgy outfit like Ken Hill's if reputable casinos are offering online betting. Best way to keep organised crime out of the business.
Posted by: Eric at June 26, 2006 05:16 PM (5yrYP)
5
I've just written to Duh-lton McGuilty ('had to rein myself in from addressing him this way) to tell him how angry and disgusted I am by both his government and David Panderson--er, Peterson.
I said voters needed an immediate opportunity to vote either confidence or no confidence in his government. I also told him, politely of course, to get his a** out into the public, to address the electorate, to defend his government's actions which, we all know, are indefensible.
All of this is ABSOLUTE NONSENSE. We, meaning the Brits and the French, could have kicked the Natives into Kingdom Come if we had wanted to. As usual, nice guys always come last...
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 26, 2006 05:52 PM (Bjar7)
6
I tried to post this earlier but was getting "temporary site issues" messages. It's unfortunate that within this time, comments have focused more on "Indian" bashing, rather than the key Native Mafia players.
Mr. Janke has done a great job of exposing some real issues behind the land treaties, answering the questions, "Why this parcel of land? Why at this time?" Let's try to stay focused on his excellent reporting, about people with thier hands in the pie, and not policing concerns.
Now for my original comment:
Yes, Steve. It is the same Steve Williams. As for coincidences, there's a belief in Native circles, that there is no such thing as a coincidence. That applies more than ever here.
You really got the goods here, Steve. You've summed things up pretty well, with some solid investigating.
The only thing you've got a little wrong is the elected band council position. Though some are opposed, there are a number of them in Ken Hill's pocket. At least half, if not more. They just don't have a controlling interest in decisions. However, they are good at stifling any progress that doesn't involve Mr. Hill.
Posted by: Hawk Eye at June 26, 2006 09:23 PM (fy6Hv)
7
Phantom,
Why do we treat Indians with kid gloves? The answer is easy. The natives are armed, militant and organized. You try to enforce the law in Ontario and Manitoba gets beaten on. You try to remove a few protesters in Quebec and suddenly their are hundreds of warriors with guns just waiting for an excuse to start shooting. The governments are intimidated by what are basically well funded, cooperative paramilitary groups. Taking on the natives now would be harder than taking on the Hell's Angels. Think about it, the paramilitaries (I loath calling them Aboriginal Canadians) have shown that they are willing to break the law, destroy infrastructure, intimidate and terrorize local citizens, just to make a point. What will happen if they actually get mad and want to cause real trouble?
The paramilitaries know Canada. They know the infrastructure in Canada. Imagine if they want to bring Canada to it's knees. One well coordinated attack would be all that's needed. Blow up a few hydro lines in Quebec. Block a few highways and bridges in Ontario and British Columbia. Block a few railways in Western Canada. Blow up a couple of pipelines in Alberta. This scenario would be a body blow to Canada. Every target I mentioned has something to do with trade to the United States. The loss of income would be enormous, not to mention any penalties Canadian businesses would have to pay for failure to provide goods and services on time.
I am not trying to fear monger here. This scenario is possible. The paramilitaries are equipped to do it. They have shown the capability several times when things in Caledonia were not going their way. Remember the blocked railway lines near Kingston, Ontario and the blocked bridges in British Columbia? Plus with sympathy from the international community (remember the recent case before the UN) they wouldn't have to worry about retribution from Canada. And if they did they could simply cross the border via certain border reserves and escape into the United States.
Someone please show me how I am wrong on this one.
Posted by: jgriffin at June 26, 2006 09:28 PM (aJ4E1)
8
Poetic Justice:
Apache Attack hHlicopter!
Posted by: Dave at June 27, 2006 12:45 AM (xoXVY)
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jgriffin states;
"Blow up a few hydro lines in Quebec. Block a few highways and bridges in Ontario and British Columbia. Block a few railways in Western Canada. Blow up a couple of pipelines in Alberta."
Perhaps that is exactly what is needed to show the populace who the terrorists are in Canada and provide the incentive to squash this ridiculous show of lawlessness.
Capitulating to the demands of this group only emboldens the others to do exactly the same. The Ontario Premier has provided yet another precedent for the Six Nations to use in other disputes of this nature.
As is normal, the aggressors will focus on these incidents in the future and disregard the fact that; if this land had been settled in the manner of the Spanish, Dutch or American colonists instead of the open-armed approach of the British under Queen Victoria's rule....well, let's just say many of thier ancestors may not have had a voice at all.
They have forgotten how Canada provided refuge when the Americans were distributing infected blankets in thier communities. How they were received by "The Great Grandmother" and given voice to negotiate treaties. It may not have been a perfect solution, but it provided a base to work from and was a far cry better then the genocide they could have been facing in other circumstances.
History can be an effective teacher but the student has the choice of what lessons are learned.
Posted by: Jan Schaafsma at June 27, 2006 12:57 AM (BqPuU)
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JGriffin is bang on. You have heard repeatedly from Monty Quinter, McGuinty and Peterson, "What are we going to do start firing at each other and risk several casualties." Why do these public officials say this? Because they are well aware of the arsenal the Canadian Gov't has allowed the Mohawk Warriors to acquire. This is also why the OPP chose to leave the Indians alone in Caledonia whenever they committed crimes. They do not want to ignite that firepower. As opposed to other terrorist groups they can play the sympathetic Indian race card for all its worth internationally. Mind you, that doesn't seem to bother the US. They declared martial law against New York Natives not to long ago and that protest ended quite quickly. Not without bloodshed however. Our only hope is that Harper is methodically planning a strategy to end this Indian bull shit. Let's hope.
Posted by: SickofMilitantIndians at June 27, 2006 07:55 AM (wZLWV)
11
Well over 10 years ago - on a Prodigy Canada account of all things - I made a comment in response to a crack about illegal guns and the need for a gun registry.
I stated that the most well armed militia of organized gun carriers was undoubtedly the Indians.
Boy did I get chastized, scorned, ridiculed and insulted.
Looks like I might not have been so far adrift after all....
Posted by: Brian M. at June 27, 2006 08:03 PM (L/Baa)
12
...I got a question no one seems to ask - how big a force do we need to change this 'native' issue around?
I mean, some suggest abolishing the reserves. Hokie...how big a force will we need to do this?
And I don't mean military.
Let's start from the bottom of the governmental cess pool - the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs.
How many people are willing to loose their cushy desk jobs to do what is right?
Then start up the ladder. How many lawyers and judges are willing to call a spade a spade and uphold the real common law in Canada? You break the law, you do time - all of it.
Then further up the ladder, how many politicians are willing to make it their crusade for a new Canada, to restore her to her former glory as a respected (and feared) nation?
Going further up, how many people are willing to sacrifice a bit of time and money to incorporate all these "drunken indian's" into mainstream work place and society? And I dont' mean soup kitchens.
Finally, how many Liberals does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
None, they don't realize it is burnt out because inside their heads, they think they are the light...
Seeing most legal and political officers, government departmentals are either from Liberal mindsets or Quebec connected, well you get my drift.
In other words, we're asking for a major overhaul of the Canadian psyche'. I don't think this will happen in my generation, or the next 20 years.
Funny, an old saying 'you reap what you sowed' is coming to pass in Canada. Harvest days are here upon us and the fruit is rotten.
The only thing we can hope for is an early frost to kill this horrible harvest, so we can plant and plan anew for next year.
Thing is, how big and strong a force will this frost have to be?
Posted by: tomax7 at June 27, 2006 08:58 PM (jHhd0)
13
Tomax, maybe you're unfamiliar with the constitution, but
it isn't up to "us". The rights of aboriginal peoples are protected and enshrined in treaties that form part and parcel of the Constitution. (See section 35).
Canada can't go unilaterally changing or altering its commitments to aboriginals. (Nor should it, but that's another matter). Especially when it drags negotiations on matters like land claims out not for weeks, or months, or even years, but decades and decades.
I spend a lot of time at Six Nations and I know a lot of people there. By and large, they *do not want confrontation*, they want negotiation in good faith, which is what government after government refuses to give them. (The recent standoff was a prime example... two levels of government desperately trying to pass the buck to each other, each pretending it's somebody else's problem. At least Ontario decided to do something to end the charade.)
It's time for Canada to bite the bullet and step up to the table.
Posted by: Craigers at June 27, 2006 09:20 PM (W84zn)
14
One more point.
Capitulating to the demands of this group only emboldens the others to do exactly the same.
But the demands are, by and large, only to negotiate - which Ontario can't do anyway. (That's a federal responsibility). What Ontario has done is to prevent the situation from getting even more ridiculously out of hand, by agreeing to step in the middle and buy the disputed piece of land and hold it in trust until the claim surrounding it is settled.
Posted by: Craigers at June 27, 2006 09:29 PM (W84zn)
15
'Tomax, maybe you're unfamiliar with the constitution, but it isn't up to "us". The rights of aboriginal peoples are protected and enshrined in treaties that form part and parcel of the Constitution'
- Well, Constitutions can be changed. So what rights are in the constitution? Maybe I should be more familiar, but we seem to be missing something if a bunch of people can burn bridges, dig up a highway and beat up people in front of police...
' By and large, they *do not want confrontation*, they want negotiation in good faith...'
- Well of course, who'd want to change an easy going lifestyle and be accounable for what they do? As long as white man sleeps, they are free to enforce their rights under the constitution/treaty.
So as the whatever ancient proverb goes: don't wake up a sleeping dog.
Billions into Indian and Norther Affairs. I wonder if anyone's figured out how much that means per native. Crap they all should be millionaires by now.
Well they are not, so who's got the money?
Posted by: tomax7 at June 27, 2006 11:37 PM (jHhd0)
16
Time for a little perspective...
Right or wrong, treaties or no treaties, the Riel Rebellion was put down. The rule of law was upheld.
Why is assault, vandalism, robbery and attemted murder OK now?
Has Politically Correct so destroyed our collective common sense?
Reverse racism is still racism, crime is still crime, and no free society should ever tolerate either one.
"Craigers":
It's not a treaty issue. It may have been generations ago, before they sold the land and legal title was established. Now it's just criminality, nothing more. Should Germany re-invade Poland to get back what they lost in 1945?
The "force of law" is a collective concept of all of us. Immensely strong, but like a fine fabric, one rip and the fabric is ruined for all of us.
This is serious shit, with long-term ramifications for all. It needs to be ended, now.
Posted by: Mad Mike at June 28, 2006 02:00 AM (tDoha)
17
The "force of law" is a collective concept of all of us. Immensely strong, but like a fine fabric, one rip and the fabric is ruined for all of us.
You have a very fragile view of the rule of law - and in fact, I agree that the rule of law should not brook exceptions. But the law is not destroyed by those who break it, it never is. It's far more robust than you would believe.
Now I'm not defending what is being done - I'm pointing to motivations, not justifications. And it's all very well for those of you far away to pontificate, but I live in the area and I have to deal with the long term consequences if it's handled badly. I'd rather have temporary problems than permanent warfare, and not just because I spend time in both communities.
From 100 or 1,000 (or 10,000) miles away it's so easy to encourage the use of force or heavy-handed tactics, because you know that however far away you are it won't touch you or the people you care about.
"Craigers":
It's not a treaty issue. It may have been generations ago, before they sold the land and legal title was established.
I'm sorry, but you appear not to have a clue what this is about. That's the precise claim that is involved... that the supposed "sale" of the land was in fact intended only as a lease. Now that's a classic land claim. The problem is that since those claims were first made (in 1974, I might add) Canada has done nothing but sit on them and refuse to move them forward or negotiate them. Given that the land subject to the claim was about to be developed, subdivided and sold with permits all lined up and accounted for (therefore confusing and adding layers of complexity to that exact legal title you referred to) without the three-decades-old claim ever having been negotiated, let alone adjudicated... I can understand the desire to do something about it.
I'll leave alone the issue that's been raised by the federal commission for land claims and any others who've reviewed the history, which is that sales (as opposed to leases) appear to have been illegal and that in fact neither the bands themselves nor the Crown as trustee actually had any color of right to sell legal title. That gets into a whole legalistic mess.
I don't approve of many of the tactics (denying court orders, blockading roads bridges and highways, allowing outside "professional protesters" to take over what is a Six Nations issue) and I hate what the OPP has done probably more than anyone else (because it means that my family and friends are far less safe than they should be) but the blame for this can't totally be on one side of a dispute. To think otherwise is
horribly naive.
Posted by: Craigers at June 28, 2006 10:29 AM (W84zn)
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"...the blame for this can't totally be on one side of a dispute."
Sure it can Craigers. If Steve is right, and there is no reason to think he isn't, what we have here is an entirely one sided criminal action by a small group. Punks taking advantage of a power vacuum.
The people REALLY getting the shaft here are the Six Nations reserve residents. Long after this is all over, Caledonia people are going to be looking at them funny. If the government caves and just gives away the land, this is going to fester for 50 years.
Nice going, Warriors.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 28, 2006 10:50 AM (nAMT1)
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I now know where the phrase "Indian Giver" comes from.
While driving through the Six Nations Reserve you will observe minimum over a hundred smoke shacks. Someone recently told me that Natives receive a $75,000 grant for business start-ups. Can anyone confirm this for me. Steve I would also like to see a list of all the financial entitlements available to Natives. I'm sure if the average Canadian was aware of these benefits, there would not be so many sympathetic to the Native "Cry me a river" rhetoric we hear over and over.
Posted by: Hound Dog at June 28, 2006 11:38 AM (BjOjj)
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Hound Dog while your at it can you also look into how much money "Canada" receives from natural resources that it exports. Do you have any land that maybe I can have, hell why am I asking shit I'll just go and take it since in my eyes your not using it. Don't worry I'll send you piece meal payments every now and again from the resources that lay in your lands, damn let it slip again I mean my land. Don't think of trying to get it back, don't make me unleash another epidemic on your ass. Starting to sound familiar all you narrow minded colonialist peeons.
Posted by: at July 08, 2006 05:55 PM (R4nxU)
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June 25, 2006
The Six Nations Gambling Fight
The more I delve into the history of gambling on the Six Nations Reserve in Caledonia, the more I think there are issues behind the Caledonia land dispute that have nothing to do with land.
Imagine this scenario. You are a successful businessman. You want to expand into gambling, but you are being harassed by a local council that is worried about laws that you don't think apply. You try to do an end run around them, they fight back, you persist -- and in all of this, you are wondering just how can you get these troubling people out of the way. You know that gambling is not popular with the voters. If you can somehow swing the voters to your side, you can cut the council off at the legs and get what you want. You are the largest employer in the area, but that doesn't seem to be enough. You are respected, but the people aren't going to give you a blank cheque just because you run a local factory. You need to be a hero! What better way than to put it all on the line, take on forces larger than yourself in a classic David-vs-Goliath battle, and if you're lucky, get yourself roughed up, just a little. Now the people don't just respect you, they adore you. Those cowards on the local council know you have the people behind you, and realize that they will need to pay a price to keep their jobs. That price is to give what you wanted in the first place -- the sole right to managed a lucrative gambling interest without interference or resistance.
Is this Ken Hill's plan?
more...
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Steve, if you're right about this, you better move to a safehouse somewhere in Saskatchewan, and sleep with a 12-guage.
How are we ever going to clean up this corrupt mess?
Posted by: ml at June 25, 2006 11:28 PM (F9NDS)
Posted by: Gary McHale at June 26, 2006 06:31 AM (CdxYW)
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Steve, you are one guy working out of Toronto on the internet. You were able to dig up all this juicy news fairly quick, like within a week or so of Ken Hill's name being published for assault.
Dalton McGuinty, Premier of Ontario which is the most populous and richest province in the country, has access to CSIS info, OPP info, not to mention lots of cooperating American cop/spy outfits and satelite surveilance and gawd only knows what else.
In your opinion, is it even faintly reasonable that our Dalton wouldn't know this information about Ken Hill?
Posted by: The Phantom at June 26, 2006 09:12 AM (nAMT1)
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I don't know what McGuinty knows. He doesn't do his own research, so he knows only what his people tell him. Who knows what they filter out? Of course, people have the remarkable ability to ignore what they don't to hear.
But my posts aren't aimed at McGuinty (though it would be nice to know if he or his people read them). They are aimed at you guys, since it is pretty obvious the main stream media is not talking about these links. If they aren't saying anything, you won't hear about it. Who knows? Maybe I can goad them into apply some their research and interviewing muscle into checkng out this angle.
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 26, 2006 09:17 AM (pFrk8)
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That would be nice, eh? Media doing actual work for a change.
Your theory makes a lot more sense than a sudden freakout of land claim activists. Their statements are so crazy, they have to be made strictly for the rubes.
As to Dalton and his boys, I can't decide if him knowing its all a gambling scam is worse than him not knowing. The first indicates a truly cynical political calculation on Dalton's part, the second indicates total and abject incompetence at all levels of government.
I just put two and two together and get four. Warrior Society is running most of the smuggling in the area because they have access to the border. Warrior Society is running the casinos. Ken Hill made his money on smuggled smokes. Warrior Society members recently busted for running guns into Toronto.
That's just from your site and the media which we agree is doing its best not to pay attention. Add in Oka and Ipperwash, plus the internet stuff, and hey presto, and we have what looks like a criminal enterprise of huge proportions acting with government permission.
Meanwhile up north the reservations don't have clean water and people live like rats.
Paints a pretty ugly picture of governance in this country. Thinking maybe we should look into that at some length.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 26, 2006 10:01 AM (nAMT1)
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Rumors persist as well Steve that the Six Nations Reserve is one of the largest portals of drug smuggling in North America. Gun smuggling is also rumored to be a major source of revenue for the poor (don't pay income taxes, get paid to go to school and university, business grants to open smoke shops) little Indians. Have you been able to uncover any evidence to these claims? Who better to smuggle anything illegal across the border then a North American Indian who is not scrutinized when crossing.
Posted by: Sick of the Native Bull S$#t at June 26, 2006 04:14 PM (wZLWV)
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June 24, 2006
A white man's worst nightmare
From a reader who calls himself awhitemansworstnightmare (aka "Six Nations Resident, and Pround as hell to be native"), who posted this comment on June 24, 2006 at 3:46 PM:
I read alot of the stuff you creeps have on this website. Is this a KKK website? Of all the artcles and comments i read, not one had nething good to say about natives.
First things first. Thanks for coming by. I'm glad I'm being read by both sides in this conflict. I hope you keep coming back, and that you participate in the discussions.
Moving on, I'm not sure why you think you are the "white man's worst nightmare". As a man with children, my worst nightmare is probably very similar to the worst nightmare of all fathers regardless of their race or creed. If you are thinking of some lesser nightmare that is somehow a function of my skin colour, I suppose the worst nightmare of the white man is the same as the worst nightmare of the black man or the red man (I'm keeping with the colour motif, even though "redskin" has falling out of favour in modern parlance, and thankfully so). That is to be punished for something he can't help -- the colour of his skin.
Is that who you are? A person who seeks out and hurts white people just for being white? I suppose that would make you a white man's worst nightmare. Must keep you pretty busy, though. So many white men, women, and children out there...but then you said "white man's nightmare", so perhaps you have limits. Or maybe you just thought "white person's nightmare" sounded clumsy and therefore not as threatening (and you'd be right).
But back to the question of punishment. I don't mind being punished for something I have done. I would like to the see the protesters punished for the things they have done. But I don't want anyone punished just because they are white, or aboriginal.
And the same goes in the other direction. I don't want anyone to avoid punishment just because they are white, or aboriginal.
As for whether this is a Klan site, I can assure you the Klan would not have me. As a Polish Catholic, I would be no more welcome in their ranks than you, anti-Catholicism being a founding principle of the Klan.
But I suppose when you want to make a critical point, it always helps to toss out the accusation of racism. Trying to get the other guy to start apologizing and backtracking just to avoid the label, eh?
Ain't going to happen here. I know I'm not a racist. Just harshly critical of criminal behaviour, especially when it appears to be institutionalized.
Don't confuse harshly critical with racism. When you equate the two, you shut down criticism. Shutting down criticism is the mark of the Fascist.
[And some friendly advice. Drop the "creeps". It doesn't bother me -- name-calling rarely does -- which makes it a wasted effort on your part. It also makes you look petty, which means that should you decide to contribute something substantive to the discussion, people might ignore you, and that would be a shame. But hey, if that's your style and it works for you, carry on.]
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Aw, come on, Steve, really. I sense a pot and kettle contest here. Wasn't it you yourself who just finished going after a certain union leader who had dared be critical of the Israeli state* by suggesting that his next move would be to flog the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion in Ontario schools? In other words, you would shut him down by calling him an anti-Semite.
*I have no idea why you object to this terminology. It's the state, not the people, who are being criticized. The word "Israel" refers, confusingly, to both. We both know that there are a lot of Israelis who disagree strongly with what the state of Israel is doing.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 09:01 PM (2cg9c)
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Years ago, I worked with natives on a job in northern Saskatchewan, shared camp rooms with them, ate three meals a day with them, hung out with them in the evenings, I used to pick up native hitchhikers and sometimes drove out of my way to drop them off. I even had a relationship for a while with a woman who is half-Cree. Those days are long gone, I got the modern message, I'm a "white man".
Posted by: anon at June 24, 2006 09:04 PM (Uagor)
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I have no sympathy for aboriginals...they are becoming our worst enemy...worse than Al Quaida...there will come a day when when need to decide in favour of our own survival, and napalm the indian reservations because they are staging an insurgence through them...sneaking weapons, gangster casinos, underground tobacco and cocaine and heroine...either they become citizens and abide the law or they should be exterminated.
D
Posted by: David Lockwood at June 24, 2006 09:41 PM (CX3wj)
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Um, David. I believe believe that what the natives are doing is wrong on many levels but I believe that your comments are way out to lunch. First of all people should never be treated as you described. Eliminating any person is wrong. Thus the question turns to how can these problems be solved? Can they be solved by buying the land from a developer and jsut giving in? Of course not,. It can only be solved by BOTH sides listening to the law and when one does not it means that extraordinary measures must be taken to resolve the issue. But if you give in then you will have a hundred reserves doing the same thing. One group is saying it owns the entire city of Ottawa. Now does that make sence. When Harris told the OPP to deal with the problem idd it happen again? NO IT DIDNT. 10 Years without crap like that happening. Now theis damn smart government comes in and suddenly they are telling the natives that they can PROFIT fromt his behaviour. Does this make sense? Damn I wish we had Harris back so that this can be settled where it belongs. This entire occupation is crap. They have papers proving that the land was sold. The judge wknows this and that was why he ordered them off the land but McGuinty continues to tell teh OPP to do nothing. Leasership is teh problem in this Province, we have none!
Posted by: Deepthinker at June 24, 2006 10:57 PM (LFnAw)
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, "white man's worst nightmare" (give me a break).
Big f**kin' deal. Native activists have been spouting this "tough guy" B.S. for as long as I can remember.
All they ever do is blockade a few roads - - IN THE SUMMER! Why is it that you "tough guys" never blockade roads in January? Gee, it might be a little uncomfortable on your soft little tootsies to be standing around in minus 30 wouldn't it?
Also, why is it whenever we see news photos of these blockades you dipshits always have ski masks on or your faces covered with bandanas? I mean I thought big tough native protestors like you wouldn't be afraid to show your faces.
I remember Oka. When the army showed up the big tough guys ran behind the women and children because they knew the army wouldn't force their way through women & kids.
Do you remember that famous Maclean's cover photo with the Indian and soldier staring at each other? The soldier stood toe to toe with the indian, no mask no sunglasses. The indian had on both. Big man, having a stare down with somebody while wearing shades. (I guess he didn't want the soldier to see him blink). Yep, a "real tough guy". Who had more balls in THAT confrontation? The answer is pretty clear.
So keep up the bluster "nightmare". Who gives a sh*t?
Posted by: John at June 24, 2006 11:02 PM (igNA6)
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Pretty much sums it up John
Posted by: RNC at June 24, 2006 11:42 PM (4zSLv)
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Sounds like a troll to me.
Posted by: Pat at June 25, 2006 02:53 AM (bxOjK)
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A well-reasoned rebuttal, Steve.
One reason I continue to link to and quote from your site.
( Just an old Keyboard Cowboy, Ridin' the Trakball into the Dawn of Information... )
Posted by: backhoe at June 25, 2006 04:08 AM (+Zuxe)
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The rule of law is the rule of law. It has to be that way if we want to live in a uncorrupt society. That even-handedness of law is precisely how minorities receive equal and fair treatment.
We "creeps" are insisting that the Province of Ontario uphold the law, for the benefit of all. A thinking person will realize that the Liberal Party of Ontario, just like the federal Liberal Party, has tipped into the abyss. Oaths of office have been breached.
We know who the creeps are in this case. They are the vandals, thugs, intimidators, scofflaws and self-serving marginal members of society running about with flags and bandanas. Whether their cause is just or not is now overshadowed by their unilateral behavior. Beyond lacking intelligence, we find that reprehensible and call upon our authorities to act in accordance with the powers invested in them.
Posted by: Shaken at June 25, 2006 07:47 AM (JyC7p)
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"Of all the artcles and comments i read, not one had nething good to say about natives"
Perhaps the lawless public behaviour of natives, the corruption of native leadership and the criminality of the native mafia ( warrior clans) has something to do with it?
However, to put the "single" positive comment on this site about natives, to placate your paper thin sensitivities, I will be eternally grateful to Elijah Harper for being instrumental in killing the Meech Lake Accord.
Posted by: wlyonmackenzie at June 25, 2006 07:48 AM (sdMWv)
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Personal friend of mine is a Navajo. I've got an awesome Navajo rug her aunt made for us hanging on my wall right now.
Here's a woman whose husband was murdered when they were both really young. Mother murdered. Brother's in jail for killing four people with his truck, drunk off his ass. Sister's kids are little drug addicts.
She is a physician. In school she was dead comitted to doing medicine on the Rez "for her people". Got her degree, did her residency, moved back to the Rez and lasted six frickin' months before she couldn't take the abuse anymore and moved to Montanna. Not on the Rez either, workin' in the White Man's world, you bet.
Let that little slice of reality enlighten "awhitemansworstnightmare" and anybody else who thinks Da White Man is the guy making life hard for the Red Man.
By the way, my worst nightmare is not some pissant I can fight one on one. Dalton McGuinty, now that guy scares the hell out of me.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 25, 2006 09:10 AM (nAMT1)
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I'm with you Phantom: Duh-lton McGuilty scares the Hell out of me, too. I live in Ontario, and to my credit, I did not vote for the Liberals.
Duh-lton is a dolt and a phantom (apologies to you, Phantom). When you need him, he's nowhere to be found, and then when he emerges from the ether, he does things which are absolutely incomprehensible: So now Ontarians own the development that the Six Nations disapproved of. Now what? Is Duh-lton going to give in to all of the SN's demands, demands they have pressed by illegal blockades and criminal activities?
Does that mean, that if the government aids and abets thugs and criminals by giving into all of their demands, that all any group needs to do in Ontario to win their case is to allege wrongdoing on the part of the other party, occupy the other party's territory/land, intimidate and harrass anyone who disagrees with the claim, ensure that law enforcers (aka the OPP) lay not a finger on the occupiers, and voila, you're in like Flint and to Hell with law and order?
It sure seems like lawlessness, chaos, and anarchy reign in Ontario. And where is Duh-lton? As usual, nowhere to be found. He should be giving press conferences every day to keep Ontarians abreast of what's going on, of what needs to happen, of how his government is going to clean up this sorry mess.
'Doesn't look like this is going to happen...'Only in Canada, you say?
What a mess.
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 25, 2006 09:43 AM (Bjar7)
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Look, let's ignore everything for a second and just focus on this one statement: the law is supposed to be colour blind. Clearly there are some concerns held by the native protestors in Caledonia. But there are better ways to get them addressed than by engaging in outright criminal behaviour as some have.
We're all Canadians, equal before the law. It's not racist to suggest that if you commit a crime, you should go to jail for it. The idea that racism comes into the Caledonia dispute is a red herring that distracts from the real issues that need to be examined. If I burn a bridge, I should go to jail for it - so should an aboriginal person if he or she does the same. I'd venture that it's racist to punish people differently for the same crime based upon their 'race' - so why, other than the fact that McGuinty is afraid of another Ipperwash, haven't some of the Caledonia protestors been arrested?
Posted by: Dante at June 25, 2006 01:13 PM (r63g0)
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The native leaders worst fear is that one day aboriginals will be treated as human beings equal in every way to other human beings. And it's not that they(the leaders) will be treated worse but that they will no longer be treated better.
Posted by: Moneybags4me at June 25, 2006 01:36 PM (zHlQZ)
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I'm hoping to start a trend - please let's start calling Ontario's premier "Duh-lton McWimpy".
Posted by: Steve at June 25, 2006 01:50 PM (gMi15)
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Dante,
The aboriginals do not consider themselves Canadians. They consider them selves an independent nation. Caledonia is not an Ontario problem, it is an international incident. My understanding is that the Six Nations "protesters" consider all of the land on the original grant theirs therefore anything that happens is subject to the Great Law not Canadian law. As long as the Six Nations legal system is not objecting to what is going on in Caledonia then, to the "protesters" what is going on in Caledonia is not illegal.
Posted by: jgriffin at June 25, 2006 02:51 PM (aJ4E1)
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Steve, you have not posted anything openly racist on your site; however, your site and other prominent conservative sites frequently have racist comments posted in your comments section. An aborginal could very easily surf this site and assume it was of the KKK variety - a consequence of allowing open comments, one supposes. Also you know that when you criticize Aboriginal protesters or Afrocentric educators you are going to attract racist elements (the same way those blogs critical Israel's behaviour in the middle east attract antisemitic commenters). All publicity is good publicity, right?
Posted by: Cynapse at June 25, 2006 05:19 PM (mnDGT)
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jgriffin that is ridiculous. It doesn't matter what the Indians have convinced themselves of they are Canadians and this is a Canadian problem that one way or another will be solved by Canadians.
Posted by: Moneybags4me at June 25, 2006 05:31 PM (zHlQZ)
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My God, I actually agree with Angry about something. Someone shoot me quick before I turn in to a religion peddling, tax cut whoring, economy bankrupting, homophobe!
What's next, me agreeing with Small Dead Animals? *shudder*
Posted by: Hishighness at June 25, 2006 05:45 PM (eSSs8)
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Also you know that when you criticize Aboriginal protesters or Afrocentric educators you are going to attract racist elements (the same way those blogs critical of Israel's behaviour in the middle east attract antisemitic commenters).
Well, anyone critical of Israel is anti-Semitic by definition, right? Has a stack of
The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion all ready to hand out to school kids?
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 25, 2006 06:00 PM (2cg9c)
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I'll shoot you!! Don't worry I'll do it! Clean kill! First shot! Give me your name & address! Pick me! Pick me!
Posted by: John at June 25, 2006 06:01 PM (igNA6)
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The Native activists have far too much time on their hands. According to them they own all the land in the Country. Who developed the land? Who built the Country we now call Canada? How long has it been since the Indians lived in teepees and lived off the land completely? How many of these people would have survived without all the technologies, medical discoveries to save lives in the modern society which has evolved since the Country formed? They are making full use of everything the modern society has and spitting in our faces at every opportunity and frankly most of us have had about enough. The governments at all levels had better rein them in and demand they behave as all citizens of Canada are obliged to do in a civilized nation. If they can't get along with all the perks afforded them, tough. Don't bother pulling the racist card, it's bogus and nothing more than the last refuge of scoundrels. Shameful.
Posted by: Liz Jackson at June 25, 2006 06:47 PM (QUoQX)
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It is worth remembering that the pejorative "Indian giver" entered the lexicon because our ancestors could immediately identify with the truth lying behind the statement.
Posted by: Dave at June 25, 2006 07:18 PM (RgQmG)
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Money bags,
Ridiculous or not that is what they believe from what I am able to determine. They have some evidence of at least their non-Canadian status to back them up.
1. They were an independent nation when they given their original grants and reserves.
2. National governments negotiate treaties with them. Not as private citizens but as equals.
3. They do not pay Canadian taxes, as Canada is a foreign nation.
The list goes on but I won't bore you with it. That said, I have some simple questions for the SN and any other band receiving Canadian tax dollars.
1. If Canada has not received this land in perpetuity then why is Canada paying over eight billion dollars a year for it?
2. If Canada has not received this land in perpetuity then why was it necessary to set aside reserves for your future generations?
3. If you are a sovereign nation then why is Canada responsible for your well being?
4. If you are a sovereign nation then why are you not recognized by any legitimate government?
5. If you are not Canadian then why do you travel on a Canadian passport?
Posted by: jgriffin at June 25, 2006 10:30 PM (aJ4E1)
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Dawg, I'll tell you what. You go down to Caledonia and check out what those Warrior Society a-holes are doing in person like I did on Friday, and then maybe your opinion will be a little more informed.
From my brief look, it seems quite obvious they have created an armed camp and are preparing more as time goes by. You want pictures, I've got pictures.
What kind of people create an armed camp on land that is NOT theirs in a sleepy little Ontario town where nothing ever happens? I don't think it racist to suggest they are criminal scum.
Posted by: The Phantom at June 26, 2006 09:02 AM (nAMT1)
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Steve, you have not posted anything openly racist on your site; however, your site and other prominent conservative sites frequently have racist comments posted in your comments section.
I suppose that's true, but then I don't see myself as wise enough to pass judgment. I'll let the marketplace of ideas take care of that, deciding what comments are worth debating, deserve to be ignored, or need to be seriously flamed.
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 26, 2006 09:12 AM (pFrk8)
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Okay jgriffin, now your making sense particularly your questions. They can't have it both ways.
The politicians for too long have been letting them think that they can.
Posted by: Moneybags4me at June 26, 2006 10:14 PM (zHlQZ)
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Not understanding this issue and attempting to deal with it is a quick way to civil war, which is a real possibility.
The treaties signed state what our responsibility is to aboriginal people while we are permitted to live off thier land.
However, the fact they live in squalor is just as much a stain on the Chiefs as it is on the Canadian Government.
Jim Prentice is a smart guy, he understands these distinctions, and I'm sure will target investment in particular areas.
Now if only the accountability act didn't get softened up for the Chiefs. I've only ever met one Chief who wasn't crooked.
Posted by: Lore_Weaver at June 27, 2006 12:56 AM (4keCT)
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Aw, come on, Steve, really. I sense a pot and kettle contest here. Wasn't it you yourself who just finished going after a certain union leader who had dared be critical of the Israeli state* by suggesting that his next move would be to flog the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion in Ontario schools? In other words, you would shut him down by calling him an anti-Semite.
Conservatives have their own client minorities as well now. Blacks and natives are still fair game for punishment but Jews are off limits (lest you be called antisemitic). It seems that liberals and conservatives continue to steal from one other's playbooks - group identity reigns.
Posted by: Cynapse at June 27, 2006 07:41 AM (TsEN3)
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Here you can leave your mark
Posted by: billie at July 05, 2006 06:02 PM (GirT6)
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CUPE: A house divided
The Ontario branch of CUPE, the Canadian Union of Public Employees, fancies itself a mover and shaker in international affairs. Recently, it passed a resolution calling on a boycott of Israel:
May, 27 2006 Resolution:
CUPE ONTARIO WILL:
1. With Palestine solidarity and human rights organizations, develop an education campaign about the apartheid nature of the Israeli state and the political and economic support of Canada for these practices.
2. Support the international campaign of boycott, divestment and sanctions until Israel meets its obligation to recognize the Palestinian people’s inalienable right to self- determination and fully complies with the precepts of international law including the right of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and properties as stipulated in UN resolution194.
3. Call on CUPE National to commit to research into Canadian involvement in the occupation and call on the CLC to join us in lobbying against the apartheid-like practices of the Israeli state and call for the immediate dismantling of the wall.
BECAUSE:
- The Israeli Apartheid Wall has been condemned and determined illegal under international law.
- Over 170 Palestinian political parties, unions and other organizations including the Palestinian General Federation of Trade Unions issued a call in July 2005 for a global campaign of boycotts and divestment against Israel similar to those imposed against South African Apartheid;
- CUPE BC has firmly and vocally condemned the occupation of Palestine and have initiated an education campaign about the apartheid-like practices of the Israeli state.
When I googled to get the text of the resolution, the first hit I got was from Al Awda, to which I linked. Al Awda is an organization with
a checkered history, according to the Anti-Defamation League:
Al-Awda - Right of Return Coalition, an international grassroots organization, argues that Palestinian refugees have the right to return “to their original homes and villages” which existed prior to the founding of Israel, and that they should be paid restitution for their losses. Al-Awda supports the intifada and the establishment of a Palestinian state over all the territory west of the Jordan River, including Israel. Al-Awda has organized large protests with the International Action Center and its anti-war affiliate, ANSWER. It has also been active in several anti-Israel boycott campaigns. Al-Awda considers its advocacy on behalf of Palestinians as being at the center of a global struggle against Zionism and American foreign policy. Mazin Qumsiyeh, a Yale University professor and an Al-Awda founder and leader, has called for supporting the “Iraqi resistance” against the pro-Israel “cabal” in Washington: “Only by awakening the US public and linking it to resistance movements from within the world community (including the Iraqi resistance), will this pathway to destruction be avoided.”
The website shows an Al Awda T-shirt with the phrase "Palestine will be free from the river to the sea" -- I guess that counts as the ultimate divestment of Israel.
Notice that ADL mentions that Al Awda has been active in anti-Israel boycott campaigns. One wonders if they were involved with CUPE Ontario and their leader Sid Ryan.
In any case, the resolution is tearing the union apart:
CUPE Ontario's decision to support a boycott against Israel has created "an unprecedented crisis" within the provincial union, according to the president of its largest single local.
In a letter dated June 20 and addressed to Ontario president Sid Ryan and national president Paul Moist, the head of the chapter representing 18,000 City of Toronto municipal workers says that the boycott has raised a host of problems that the Canadian Union of Public Employees could have avoided.
"As a result, much damage has been done to CUPE's reputation in the eyes of the members and the public," said Ann Dembinski, head of Local 79 in Toronto.
The unit represents about 10 per cent of the Ontario's wing's total membership.
Sid Ryan says what's done is done, and nothing can change it anytime soon:
In an interview, Mr. Ryan said the resolution was approved almost unanimously at the May meeting, which 20 members of Local 79 attended.
He said the decision could be reversed only at next year's annual meeting.
Of course, this is nonsense. The union executive can do whatever it wants if the survival of the union is being threatened.
In any case, with cheerleaders like Al Awda (and no doubt more sinister and less public organizations), it's not wonder that CUPE members are upset.
And one more thing. Did you notice that in the text of the resolution, CUPE keeps refering to Israel as "the Israeli state". Just once is the country named as "Israel". The rest of the time resolution avoids naming the "entity". Or should I say "Zionist entity"?
Nice bunch of guys, Sid Ryan and his clique. Next they'll pass a resolution demanding that the Protocols of Zion be made mandatory reading in Ontario classrooms.
[Hat tip to reader J]
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Of course, this is nonsense. The union executive can do whatever it wants if the survival of the union is being threatened.
Not true, and take it from someone who knows what he's talking about. The supreme governing body of CUPE-Ontario is its convention.
Nice bunch of guys, Sid Ryan and his clique. Next they'll pass a resolution demanding that the Protocols of Zion be made mandatory reading in Ontario classrooms.
And with this, I think you've lost it, Steve. That "any criticism of Israel is anti-Semitism" shtick is wearing a little thin. Frankly, I hope Sid sues you for defamation.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 10:57 AM (2cg9c)
2
...and I may have to eat crow with respect to the first quotation. Unlike my own union, CUPE-Ontario's Constitution is silent on convention's power and authority.
Indeed the Executive may have the power to reverse a unanimous or near-unanimous decision of its convention, at which 20 delegates from the Local in question were in attendance. But I hope they don't, and given the level of feeling at convention, they would be unwise to attempt it.
My comments on the second quotation, however, stand. You've really crossed the line on this one.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 11:18 AM (2cg9c)
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Nice post Angry. These kinds of shenanigans show just how far some unions have drifted from or even hijacked their original mandate of negotiating bendfits,better working conditions and wages for it's members.
They don't seem to realize the more they try to play outside thier sandbox the more irrelevant they become.
Posted by: Farmer Joe at June 24, 2006 11:50 AM (zHlQZ)
4
Dr. Dawg is dead wrong on defamation.
Steve Janke in no way defamed Sid Ryan's character.
What Steve Janke did do was take issue with CUPE's policy as expressed by Sid Ryan.
Where in the post does it suggest that Sid Ryan is a crook, malfeasant character, advocate of violence, or of low or evil moral character? Answer: NO WHERE.
What Steve Janke does do, is make suggestions that CUPE is risible and suggests a farcial resolution for CUPE to pass the Protocols of Zion as required reading. Making light of what Steve Janke percieves as stupidity; is known as freedom of speech and one of those protected Charter rights.
Dr. Dawg has lost it on the defamation allegation.
Posted by: Hans Rupprecht at June 24, 2006 12:39 PM (KKUfG)
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Let's let a judge decide.
Publicly defaming an individual as an anti-Semite of the "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" persuasion could be taken as injuring his reputation. As an elected public figure, Sid Ryan has, I believe, an arguable case under Ontario civil law.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 02:15 PM (2cg9c)
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Dr. Dawg:
1. What does CUPE's resolution have to do with protecting and promoting the interests of its members?
2. Would it be appropriate for a large Canadian publicly traded corporation to take a similar position as CUPE?
Posted by: reality at June 24, 2006 02:25 PM (O3lBl)
7
I would suggest, "reality," that the top leadership of CUPE-Ontario (by which I mean the elected delegation to its convention) have the right to take positions on anything they darned well feel like. That's democracy. Those people are all elected and accountable. The convention reconvenes every year. Every Locals gets to elect memebrs to go.
It's high time for non-union and anti-union types to show a little of that belief in democracy that they keep accusing the unions of ignoring.
With respect to publicly traded corporations, I guess the same principle applies--if only the AGMs were as democratic as union conventions. Do you think your rank-and-file stockholder likes to pay millions a year to CEOs? What do the latter actually do to earn money like that?
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 02:39 PM (2cg9c)
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Just a question, are people allowed to be full-time employees of the government without being required to have a membership in CUPE?
Posted by: CanForce 101 at June 24, 2006 03:12 PM (BRXB/)
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Hopefully unions will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. The leaders like Sid Ryan and Buzzy Hargrove have discredited themselves a long time ago, no one needs to do it for them. They make outrageous demands and expect everyone to jump to their tune. In a democracy they have no business interfering in the election process by supporting one party or other. People have to stop listening to these pompous twits.
Posted by: Old Biddy at June 24, 2006 03:34 PM (YoxVG)
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Oh did they say something? I hadn't noticed.
Posted by: Moneybags4me at June 24, 2006 05:04 PM (zHlQZ)
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Test (I keep getting error messages with the word "Blacklist" at the end of them). Nah...couldn't be.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 08:43 PM (2cg9c)
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Well, that's a relief.
Just a question, are people allowed to be full-time employees of the government without being required to have a membership in CUPE?
CUPE is mainly municipal workers (although it has picked up some university teaching assistants, university admin. people and a few small agencies). The Rand formula generally applies: you pay dues (and get the collective agreement benefits as well as union representation to back them up), but you do not have to sign a union card.
In a democracy they have no business interfering in the election process by supporting one party or other.
A curious notion of "democracy" you have.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 24, 2006 08:45 PM (2cg9c)
13
Just checked, and Dr Dawg is not on the blacklist. I've never added anyone to the blacklist -- it's not my style. I've banned one IP address associated with a persistent automated spammer, and that's all.
Glad to see that Dr Dawg is able to post. Can't explain why you were getting a blacklist message, though.
Sorry about that.
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 24, 2006 08:50 PM (RpQrh)
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I didn't really believe I'd been banned, Steve, although the word "Blacklist" appeared at the end of the string. I looked in vain for hidden "banned words" (e.g., so
cialis t), but found none. It was obviously some kind of glitch in your Regex, although I don't have a clue what that's about.
For the record, I think this is one of the better conservative sites, comments are not messed with, and I've blogrolled it. Which doesn't mean I'm any less steamed about your attack on Sid Ryan.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 25, 2006 07:41 AM (2cg9c)
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I have to agree with this boycott. How dare those Jooooooos settle on one of the only oil free patches of land in the middle east. Then,to build a thriving, industrious,DEMOCRATIC,country that includes a few million native Palestinians......Well it just makes my blood boil. Not to mention making their neighbours look bad. Go sid Ryan, stand proud CUPE.
Posted by: Rick at June 25, 2006 12:59 PM (qe9Nn)
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I still haven't heard a good reason why a Canadian labour union is making resolutions about another country's political disputes...
Posted by: Mac at June 27, 2006 12:11 AM (TaDbz)
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Good thing CUPE Ontario is boycotting Israel. So what if it's a democracy that promotes freedom of speech and has a flourishing union movement? CUPE Ontario may have made the mistake of boycotting innocent countries like Syria or Egypt where labour leaders are often tortured and jailed.
Good thing Sid Ryan has his priorities straight.
What a flippin joke.
Israel has become the whipping boy of the extreme left.
Posted by: KJM at June 27, 2006 01:00 PM (HClsL)
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June 23, 2006
The Humiliation of Caledonia
The latest from Caledonia has the police leaving residents to the tender mercies of criminals:
Amid concerns over lack of police action in Caledonia, the Ontario Provincial Police have turned over part of their policing responsibility on the outskirts of the town to Six Nations officers, the force confirmed yesterday.
OPP officers will no longer respond to calls from non-native home and property owners who live on the 6th Line, a county road running along the southwest border of a housing development occupied by native protesters — a move that has some residents feeling helpless and sick with worry.
"Residents are fully aware. We went door-to-door," OPP spokesman Const. Dennis Harwood told the Toronto Star yesterday.
This is just the latest twist involving the OPP that has many people — including a former OPP officer — questioning what the provincial force is doing. "They can't do that. People pay their taxes for policing by the OPP," said the former senior officer, who asked not to be identified.
People didn't just pay taxes. The County paid extra for a contract:
[Haldimand County Police Service] consist of several components. First is the actual delivery of policing which has been contracted out to the Ontario Provincial Police, second is Haldimand County Community Policing and thirdly is the Haldimand County Police Services Board. All detachments are required by provincial legislation to have a Police Services Board. The traditional policing functions are carried out under the auspices of a contract between the O.P.P and Haldimand County.
How much money was squandered on the OPP?
Protections to Persons & Property:
2005 YTD Actuals: $8,141,546
The people of Haldimand people spend $8 million for police protection, and when it really mattered, they got nothing. On the other hand, the protesters are virtually ignored by the police despite threats, robberies, and assaults, and they are rewarded with land bought at twice the amount the people of Haldimand County paid for the privilege of living under the rule of law:
Meanwhile, the developer who currently owns the land will get $12.3 million in an "interim agreement" with the province to cover the market value of the subdivision land "as is," with more money to come later, said Natural Resources Minister David Ramsay.
That land bought at $12 million (and probably much more) will be handed to the protesters sooner or later.
And it was paid for in part by the taxpayers of Haldimand County who have just wasted $8 million on nonexistent policing.
You know, fear fades with time. One day, when these events have receded into the past and daily life has settled into a new pattern, the people of Haldimand Country will wake up and they won't be afraid any more. But I bet they will feel humiliated by all this. And the thing about humiliation is that, unlike fear, the sting of it has a way of being felt as keenly as when it was fresh. You never quite shake humiliation -- it stays with you for the rest of your life.
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And the thing about humiliation is that, unlike fear, the sting of it has a way of being felt as keenly as when it was fresh. You never quite shake humiliation -- it stays with you for the rest of your life.
Just ask Canada's First Nations.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 23, 2006 06:21 PM (2cg9c)
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What a load of bullshit Dawg. The Indians in this case LOST IN COURT. They are using ILLEGAL activity in order to enforce their wishes against the legal wishes of the court. Can your crap if you have no idea what you're talking about.
Idiot.
Posted by: Joe Schmoe at June 23, 2006 06:51 PM (sATGg)
Posted by: Guardsman at June 23, 2006 06:56 PM (+ILsd)
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Dalton was asked after the pride thingy about Caledonia. He answered "Dunno, didn't see it on the menu, but the rest of the food was good. Glad I didn't have to pay the $250 though. Caledonia...was that the dessert?"
Posted by: Skip at June 23, 2006 08:33 PM (0AFOG)
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Humiliation and shame. I suspect you are correct as far as you go Steve. I wouldn't doubt that there are also more than a few OPP members who have some deep feelings regarding Caledonia.
The OPP ceding jurisdiction to the Six Nations Police would seem to indicate that a pending land transfer is a done deal.
There is more than enough shame to go around here, but as Skip pointed out Dalton has been busy in the city dealing with issues of Pride.
Interesting juxtaposition, Dalton escapes the shame of his inaction by participating in Pride week festivities. Afterall what's really important about being Canadian is sexual permutations and combinations.
Syncro
Posted by: syncrodox at June 23, 2006 08:57 PM (azwV2)
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Dullard McSuishy is thinking this will wash with the electorate?
Put a fork in the Dolt-on. He's done.
Army in. Now.
Posted by: Shaken at June 23, 2006 09:12 PM (JyC7p)
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There is little indication that John Tory would've handled this any differently, given everything he's said on this issue thus far. He's frightfully politically correct. Blaming McGuinty for this terrorist rebellion has the added effect of giving the people responsible for maintaining law and order a free pass when they (or, to be fair, the ones at the top making the decision) don't deserve it. The Caledonia situation really shouldn't be politically directed anyway, it should be a police matter. My sympathies are with the front line cops who I feel are being degraded and put at risk by decisions made by their superiors.
Some might say that OPP commissioner Gwen Boniface was an affirmative action hire, and that feminine values such as "communication" and moral relativism (everybody has a vaid point of view, right?) rather than phallocentric force have created this clusterf**k, and that as a Mohawk and as a member of the Association of First Nations Chiefs of Police she is in one hell of a conflict of interest...but nothing could be further from the truth.
Posted by: adp at June 24, 2006 05:34 AM (hzQH9)
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The puppeteers who control these "natives"made the shooting of the criminal protester,Dudley George,a big stink just for this reason. So that their next staged event wouldn't be dealt with in a lawful manner, with force if need be. The bottom line, as always,is money. We have it, they want it. Sad.
Posted by: Rick at June 24, 2006 09:35 AM (qe9Nn)
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I read alot of the stuff you creeps have on this website. Is this a KKK website? Of all the artcles and comments i read, not one had nething good to say about natives.
Posted by: Six Nations Resident, and Pround as hell to be native at June 24, 2006 03:46 PM (19++V)
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Quote "I read alot of the stuff you creeps have on this website. Is this a KKK website? Of all the artcles and comments i read, not one had nething good to say about natives." by a Six Nations Resident Welfare bum.
Want some whine with yer cheese?? You people are like any other loser group. You take from hard working average people day after day using your bullshit culture shit,can't get over the fact you were defeated lost your lands to a conqueror who by the way has been more than generous to y'all.
If any of you Indians had any gumption, you'd get off yer asses like many Aboriginal people have and do something with your lives. No instead you act like little criminals or children ranting and raving and crying racism until you get your candy.
Proud as hell to be Native?? Bullshit!!! Yer just another Welfare bum.
Posted by: Rico at June 24, 2006 10:41 PM (b/eoi)
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CALEDONIA (AM900 CHML NEWS)
Ontario's Premier has been jilted by members of the Six Nations Confederacy, one day after he called on natives to end their occupation of Douglas Creek Estates.
Confederacy spokeperson Janie Jamieson has officially rejected Dalton McGuinty's call to leave the former residential development site.
Jamieson has also repeated her insistence that they won't really know the government is serious, until their title and jurisdiction is reinstated.
The Premier called on the confederacy to end its occupation yesterday, while revealing that the province has so far paid Henco Industries 12.3-million dollars for the land.
The Premier warns the continuing occupation is unhelpful and constitutes the remaining potential for danger in Caledonia.
In the meantime, Provincial Police have issued a warrant for a seventh person accused of assaulting two CH-TV cameramen at the site of the aboriginal
standoff.
They are looking for 22-year-old Timothy Jamieson of Oshweken.
He is wanted on charges of robbery, assault and obstructing police.
***
Janie jamieson? Timothy Jamieson? A conflict of interest here?
I can't stand the fact that the government is even negotiating with anybody here. Every day we see a different "spokesperson" and they always seem to have the same last name as someone that has an arrest warrent out for them. The Clan Mothers, the hereditary Chiefs, the elected band council. Who is in charge?! Who takes responsibility? It's just anarchy. Just greed out for all it can get.
Posted by: James at June 26, 2006 07:46 AM (fmnZG)
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June 22, 2006
Creepy gay groups
The Conservatives are moving ahead on yet another promise:
The Conservative government introduced a bill on Thursday that would raise the age of sexual consent by two years to 16.
If passed, the new law would mean most adults who have sex with girls or boys aged 14 or 15 could face criminal charges.
"Adults who sexually prey upon young people are the targets of these reforms, not consenting teenagers," said Justice Minister Vic Toews, who said the bill will rename the Age of Consent law to the Age of Protection law.
Teen sex is not outlawed, though:
The proposed legislation includes a close-in-age exception, which means that teens who are 14 or 15 can have a sexual partner who is "less than five years older."
So a 40-year-old having sex with a 14-year-old will now face criminal charges.
Not everyone is happy. Egale Canada, a gay-rights advocacy group, is against it:
Egale Canada supports the current general age of consent to sexual activity of 14 because: the current Criminal Code already protects 14- and 15-year-olds from exploitive sexual activity and internet predators; the evidence does not demonstrate that increasing the age of consent will do anything other than criminalize non-harmful sexual activity; the prospect of legal sanction and third-party disclosure could discourage young people from accessing preventive and therapeutic health services and other forms of information and assistance. This effectively drives sex underground, isolates 14- and 15-year-olds, and thereby makes them more vulnerable to sexual predators.
Now note that the only sexual activity being criminalized is that between a 14- or 15-year-old teen and someone 20 or older. Sex between teens is still fine.
Egale Canada (and other gay advocacy groups against this law, such as Coalition For Lesbian And Gay Rights In Ontario) say that teens will not seek therapeutic health services.
Like buying condoms? Obviously not. Egale mentions "information and assistance". Again, what exactly are they not going to be able to find out on the internet or from friends?
Teens having sex with teens will be legal, as it is now. Nothing has changed.
The only thing that is different is that 14- and 15-year-olds are off limits to adults.
And then it stuck me. Is this what the gay lobby is really upset about?
Are gay relationships skewed more heavily towards adults having sex with young teens? Is this law really discriminatory, in that the majority of heterosexual relationships are not going to be affected, but a significant portion of homosexual ones will?
I was leery of putting this up until I saw this post on rabble:
Gay men and lesbian women seldom grow up in queer or even queer-friendly families. In my experience, for many of us, one of the first steps in coming to terms with who we are is through a relationship with someone older and more experienced who can share her or his experience and insights and help us deal with all the homophobic bullshit that we absorb from less than friendly families and communities.
Is this how adult homosexuals who have sex with teens see themselves? Helping children "find" themselves?
What's the rush? If a teen doesn't have gay sex by the time he or she is 16, he or she might go straight? That's silly.
What about young Catholic girls? If they are following the rules put down by the non-progressive Church, they are waiting until they get married. But then they aren't finding themselves sexually either. Should middle-aged men be allowed lurk near Catholic all-girl high schools so that they too can help these girls deal with the "Catholic bullshit" that they have to absorb from their "less than friendly families"?
Do these people even realize what they sound like? Look, a confused 14-year-old boy. If it weren't for the law, I could help him understand his feelings. It'll only take a few minutes...just let me get this belt...stupid thing is stuck...no wait, don't run away...I'm here to help you...damn belt....
[I patiently wait for the furious condemnations of my patently obvious homophobia. For what it's worth, I don't like to see homosexual teens being taken advantage of by predacious adults any more than seeing it happen to heterosexual teens.]
Update: I should point out that Planned Parenthood (now called the Canadian Federation for Sexual Health in many cities) is also against the change in the age of consent. Planned Parenthood is clearly not a gay advocacy group (though the group does have a major "anti-oppression" program aimed at high schools for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender youth). Planned Parenthood is primarily a pro-abortion group. You would think that any law that could have the effect of discouraging some teens from having sex and so cut down on unwanted pregnancies is something Planned Parenthood would applaud. The negative reaction (also wrapped in the nonsense that kids would still be having sex but less likely to talk about it) can be traced to the fact that anything the reduces the number of abortions in the country is something Planned Parenthood will fight vigourously against. If every pregnancy was planned by responsible and mature adults, what would Planned Parenthood have left to do? More frighteningly, how would Planned Parenthood be able to justify the $2.3 million of funding they receive each year from Ottawa? That's 80% of their budget, for crying out loud. If unwanted teen pregnancies were to decrease, some bright bulb in the government might tell Planned Parenthood that they should try to raise their money privately, assuming they are seen to provide a service perceived as valuable by their clients.
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You are treading dangerous ground here, Steve. I would bet that you will not see this mentioned in the MSM. It may be interesting to take note of which groups have problems with this legislation.
enough
Posted by: enough at June 22, 2006 07:53 PM (6sAMe)
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Steve, please try to remember that it's not homophobia... that word was coined by the homosexual lobbies to disparage those who oppose homosexuality, it's used as in "what are you afraid of?". The correct term should be a variant of homoanathema, anathema meaning something intensely disliked or loathed as in "country music is anathema to opera aficionados"
Posted by: Andrew Spencer at June 22, 2006 08:33 PM (p1agh)
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Better run for cover! The human rights commission is gonna come gunnin' for you after this post! Those "equality" groups seem to wield more power than us common folk. I'm thinking they have past equality and have zoomed ahead. SSM's,"sensitivity" classes in schools, sexual orientation in the charter, what more do they need or want? Like I've said, "they've won".
For now!!!
Posted by: Dave at June 22, 2006 08:40 PM (xoXVY)
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I don't have a problem with homosexuals but these excuses to have sex with children are just sick and don't represent the homosexuals I know.
Posted by: philanthropist at June 22, 2006 09:02 PM (7pBiD)
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Steve you made a comment that just triggered something in me.
What's the rush? If a teen doesn't have gay sex by the time he or she is 16, he or she might go straight? That's silly.
Gays should be for this legislation because they have been railing for decades that you are born gay. i.e. if these teens do not have gay sex before they are 16 they should still end up being gay. It is in nature and not nurture.
The harder Egale pushes against this legislation the more pressure they put on their nature vs. nurture argument.
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 22, 2006 09:04 PM (Xiqvi)
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Raising the age of sexual consent to protect young people from sexual perverts is the right thing to do. Many teens are confused and vulnerable thus can be taken down what could be the wrong path for them.It's a rotten society when a minority within it can dictate what it's people can talk about or write about without being called phobic this or phobic that. Frankly some segments of society scare the bejabbers out of a lot of folks. Many, perhaps most people feel the anatomy of a sexual relationship between a man and a young boy to be repugnant and rightly so. Raising the age of consent to sixteen is a good thing.
Posted by: Old Biddy at June 22, 2006 09:12 PM (ZyKRd)
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Homosexual activists have been publicly denying many ugly facts about their sexual practices, but have been especially vehement about denying the general approval and practice of pederasty amongst themselves.
They simply don't see what's wrong with grown men buggering teenage boys. It's how many of them "discovered their sexuality", as it were.
Posted by: Loyalist at June 22, 2006 09:22 PM (TwKSE)
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Steve,
I thank you making this post. I too have thought the very same thing after see the list of groups who do not support the raising of the age limit. I wish the MSM would point this out about the gay lobby. I do not understand why anyone in the country would not support the tories on this. It makes me feel 'yucky" just think about a plus 20 year old have sex with a 14 year old. But maybe that is because I have a daughter.
Posted by: Political Correct at June 22, 2006 10:20 PM (EljCX)
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I am willing to acknowledge that pederasts might be attempting to hide behind gay groups to borrow some respectability. If so, we should be hearing from legitimate gay groups supporting this more protective legislation. Right? I'm listening really loud here.
The interesting conclusion one might draw is that these people don't believe that sexual orientation is fixed and genetic. Whatever they may believe retrospectively about their own orientation, their actions indicate that they believe the issue may be in doubt for young men, and early "intervention" is important to secure their prey.
They may be deluding themselves in this, of course. Orientation may be fixed and the adults may be simply rationalizing their preference for younger males by telling themselves they are aiding their development in some way. But the gentleman's story quoted above is more consonant with the idea of some homosexual tendency in youth which was solidified by his pleasurable sexual experiences. It doesn't matter whether I think (or society thinks) the issue of his orientation was in doubt: he himself seems to think so, though he would deny it.
People can't have this both ways. One cannot simultaneously maintain that orientation is immutable while simultaneously claiming that youthful initiation is developmentally important.
Posted by: Assistant Village Idiot at June 22, 2006 10:22 PM (EabgM)
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Steve, please watch out. The human rights police are watching and you are very close to the edge....this Canada...some people's rights are way more important than yours.
Posted by: Political Correct at June 22, 2006 10:22 PM (EljCX)
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Ever hear of NAMBLA - the 'North American Man-Boy Love Association'? Just Google that one and dig a bit if you want to see the connections Steve is hinting at here. Here's
one link (and
another) to get you started, as well as a story on
why the ACLU supports NAMBLA (like that's a shocker, huh?), and a recent
MSM story about a member's wife. Keep digging, Steve.
Posted by: Linda at June 22, 2006 10:37 PM (nl0zz)
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Is it because gays generally do not have sons and daughters? I do not think any parent would not agree to a raise in the age.
Posted by: Political Correct at June 22, 2006 10:46 PM (EljCX)
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I believe you will find far more 'straight' adults who prey on children than 'gay' ones, just based on probability, populations and police reports, not that there is anything 'straight' about molesting children.
I think 16 is still quite young but certainly better than 14, for heaven's sake.
I'm actually in favour of raising the age of majority back to 21, so I'm probably a bit too conservative for most people.
Posted by: Caveat at June 22, 2006 11:22 PM (kJGJ6)
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Steve, I admire your courage to point out some obvious facts. What's the chance that the janice kennedys (feminazi writer for the Ottawa petfinder) won't go apeshit if this discussion ever went mainstream. Tread lightly my friend...
Here is another fact. The average ages between juvenile and predator is 14 and 29 respectively. That is wrong regardless of the sex of the participants. The time has come for a bit of truth surrounding these issues. Expect those afraid of the truth to attack you... we all know how intolerant the left is in this country.
This is something I have noticed and I wonder if others have also. The interim leader of the lieberals has been "outed" by a T.O. mag as someone who would be charged if the proposed legislation was in place. We have 3 declared homosexuals in the lieberal leadership race, Brison, Kennedy and Dion, with 3 others having undetermined sexual preferences. Guess what the official left wing position will be. Is there a pattern here? Just asking....
Posted by: Leslie at June 23, 2006 12:04 AM (bpzvk)
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"Gays should be for this legislation because they have been railing for decades that you are born gay."
This may be the undoing of the gay community itself. For if true that "you are born gay" there will be a specific gene that can be tested for.(just read there are hundreds of different DNA Tests) I'm sure MOST prosective parents, upon finding out that there fetus has the "gay" gene will be looking seriously at an abortion. And suddenly, I'm in favor of abortions unter certain circumstance.
Horny Toad
Posted by: Horny Toad at June 23, 2006 12:41 AM (4fYv9)
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"in favor yoMaf abortions" if the kid will be gay? Get a grip! I suppose you would be in favour of abortioons if the kid will be black cuz the mother happened to have had an affair with the black milkman!! Sheeesh!
Posted by: The Guest at June 23, 2006 01:28 AM (wEUe/)
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Typos galore, that's what u get when upset.
Posted by: The Guest at June 23, 2006 01:30 AM (wEUe/)
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These gay groups being against the proposed law make no sense! Why are they against it?
One thing this law will do is increase the number of female offenders: This because the second cohort for female on male sex assault is the 14 to 16 age group. We're not at all ready to deal with having more females arrested. We're not even a tiny bit ready to have more females arrested.
We're NOT even a little bit ready (or willing) to deal with male sex assault survivors/victims. Canada is the worst in the first world in our treatment/policy for male survivors. Hah! Many countries in the third world do a better job!
Posted by: jw at June 23, 2006 03:30 AM (OfyVr)
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I love watching the unknown none@hotmail email from The Guest fighting someone like HornyToad who has put up a legitimate email.
Horny Toad, thanks for quoting me. I guess you and Assisstant Village Idiot see my point on this argument and how it puts gay and lesbian groups in a catch 22.
I really am interested now in looking into the genome map to see if anything addresses this subject.
The Guest, get a grip. Typos happen when you get flustered, frustrated and angry and start pounding the keyboard.
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 23, 2006 07:16 AM (Xiqvi)
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The proposed change still doesn't go far enough. Any time the subject has previously come up in conversation one simple thought has always come to mind... as a 32 year old man I can't take dirty pictures of a 14 year old girl, but I can f**k her (my apologies but the crudeness seems appropriate given the contect). Changing the age to 16 does nothing to alter that obvious absurdity. I would have to question the motives of anyone, gay or straight, opposed to the change since protecting our youth doesn't seem to be their greatest priority.
Posted by: PB at June 23, 2006 07:18 AM (tTqIy)
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Thank You Steve. I've been flogging this horse ever since I started blogging and it's nice to see that someone else has finally picked up on it.
To take your suspicions a step further, the current law has the age of consent for sodomous practices at 16 already so that won't change. Your friends at EGALE however have been petitioning to have that age reduced to 14 to gain pairity with the age of heterosexual consent. Here's an old link:
"From Eagle Canada Survey:
http://www.egale.ca/index.asp?lang=E&menu=102&item=408
12. Age of Consent
The Criminal Code provides different ages of consent for different types of sexual activity. The age of consent for vaginal intercourse is four years younger than the age of consent for anal intercourse. Canadian Courts have ruled that unequal age of consent laws are unconstitutional and actually undermine education efforts about the spread of HIV by driving behaviour underground and impeding young people”s access to information which could save their lives.
Q. 12: Do you support reducing the age of consent for anal intercourse to ensure an equal age of consent for all sexual activity?"
EGALE has been pushing for "equality" and now they've gotten it. Only it wasn't the equality they wanted so now they're pissed.
In regards to pedophiles thinking that they're doing something wholesome for the kids, you're exactly right. check out the comments in this thread: http://www.northamericanpatriot.com/a_north_american_patriot/2006/04/carnival_of_ped.html
Not really, it's more about enabling children, when children are given the knowledge, they have the power. I don't want to be enabling child molestors, I simply don't want to alienate and persecute people who just like kids, that's it. Some people just like to be around kids, maybe there's no sexual component involved, maybe just being around kids it's the kids that start acting sexual because they're young and experimenting and so forth. But of course an adult will tell them how to properly express their sexuality around others. With restraint, compassion and maintainance of dignity...many things adults simply can't do."
Anyway, thanks again Angry. It's good to put this stuff out there...
Posted by: Richard Evans at June 23, 2006 07:39 AM (pyVpk)
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Richard,
You raise a good point, but the age of consent for anal intercourse is 18, not 16.
Irregardless, it's rather disturbing that these groups are pushing for equalization by lowering the age, rather than raising...
Posted by: RL at June 23, 2006 10:01 AM (MQJmo)
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You're right RL, thanks for the correction.
Posted by: Richard Evans at June 23, 2006 10:17 AM (pyVpk)
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Great post, I can't wait to see what Bill Graham says
Posted by: Darcey at June 23, 2006 10:42 AM (BVJ3o)
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WRT the connection between homosexuality and pedophelia:
http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS02E3
Posted by: Paul Buller at June 23, 2006 12:46 PM (oBKGy)
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Since the age for anal sex is 18 but for vaginal it is 16, it is understandable that Egale is still fighting for parity.
Whether on suppports that position (pun unintended!) is another matter, but it does explain why the gay rights lobby is fighting the move. Not some nepharious, pedophilia-related reason.
Personally, I agree with Egale equality is important and believe Harper should have raised the age of consent to 18 for all forms of sex (anal, oral or vaginal.)
Posted by: Kathryn in Canada at June 23, 2006 01:49 PM (gYe3t)
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The bit that caught my eye was the fact that Planned Parenthood gets $2.3M or 80% of its budget from the Feds. I don't have a problem that groups like this exist, but why do they have to be suckling at the public teat for their own purposes.
first thing that I'd like to see from a majority conservative government would be to stop funding for all "public interest" groups. If there's really a public interest, then they can do their own fundraising from the portion of the public that's really interested. If it really needs it, then I'd even consent to making donations to these groups tax deductible. But please, no more tax dollars direct to unaccountable radicals.
Posted by: SPare at June 23, 2006 01:54 PM (djUiP)
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This is feel-good legislation. Nothing more. It also has the added bonus of putting more people in jail and reducing freedom. Everything a social "conservative" could hope for.
Posted by: Greater Toronto Area Conservative at June 23, 2006 02:49 PM (0TygJ)
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Horny Toad:
Some in the homosexual community have already recognized the fact that if a 'gay gene' were isolated, then selective abortions could (and likely would) be used to eliminate homosexuality.
http://www.plagal.org/op-ed/1-20-97a.html
Posted by: MSYB at June 23, 2006 04:27 PM (O+ACo)
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Hey, Steve, thanks for lancing the boil on the dexter side of the body politic. Feel better now? There's something creepy here, all right, but it isn't "gay groups."
Your over-emphasis on gay sexuality is telling, even with your passing reference to middle-aged men hanging around outside Catholic high schools. EGALE's arguments aren't hot air--they make a lot of sense, actually, for both gay and straight sexual relationships. This is superfluous law, akin to the War on Street-Racing nonsense. It's playing to the gallery.
What--no comment about the different age limits for anal and vaginal sex? No mention of the fact that the age of consent is only being raised by two years? That it was fourteen up to now--and so much for references to NAMBLA and the whole Phelps-like panoply of hatred you've managed to extract?
But for a light touch, there's this. Thanks for the late-week laugh:
Anything the [sic] reduces the number of abortions in the country is something Planned Parenthood will fight vigourously [sic] against. If every pregnancy was [sic] planned by responsible and mature adults, what would Planned Parenthood have left to do?
Yup. That's why the medical establishment has had the cure for cancer for years. Don't want to put all those high-paid doctors out of business, now do we? What would oncologists have to justify their exorbitant claims on provincial health care plans?
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 23, 2006 06:43 PM (2cg9c)
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And, of course, no mention of the brave soldier who raped a 13-year-old girl and got off because a judge felt sorry for him. What, no criticism of bleeding-heart judges? No outrage?
Why, of course. It would be downright unpatriotic, criticizing one of our military. What did that kid ever do for her country?
Besides, the soldier was straight.
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 23, 2006 07:14 PM (2cg9c)
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Wow dog, you sure seem to want to maintain the statusquo... Anything you'd like to share with the group?
Posted by: Richard Evans at June 23, 2006 07:21 PM (pyVpk)
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Dawg:
Anything that smacks of common sence or marality offends you. So--as an evil, redneck conservative american, I can only be glad that your up there!
Let me use analogy: I really like to slap the piss out of fools, poltroons and disingenuous liberals, but it is morally wrong for me to do so.
I can be punished for such things. Rightfully.
I refrain.
Is rapeing children for the benifit of their personal development somehow exempt from morality?
Or is marality and common sence just too outdated a concept?
Posted by: Redneck American at June 24, 2006 01:04 PM (CO+Wi)
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The 'gay' agenda's greatest success has been to get the media and hence the public to buy into the homosexual activists' vocabulary to describe themselves and their concerns. Hence the word gay should go back to homosexual.
The human tendency to prefer short words for long is another reason, and so the short version 'homo' is both accurately descriptive (without prejudice) and short. So it should be referred to as the 'homo agenda'.
The homo agenda has also been successful in that it has managed to take over institutions such as BCTF in BC for example, and some say the CBC, by acting like a very focussed special interest group working together to advance in positions and preferencial hiring.
One should note, in regard to the age of consent and the pedophilic spreading of this agenda, that as soon as a homosexual became a Minister of Tony Blairs cabinet, his desire was expressed to lower the age of consent for homosexuals to 14.
Posted by: hoff at June 24, 2006 11:49 PM (e/acA)
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Listen, if Planned Parenthood were successful (remember, 80% of their funding comes from us suckered Canadian taxpayers) they'd be out of business and in no more need of millions of dollars from the government, which means their workers would be unemployed. By not looking out for the protection of sexually active teens, they forever ensure their "usefulness" in the Canadian landscape and the continuing employment of their employees. 'Talk about useful idiots. The sad thing is the cost to our young people in their health and human lives. (The STD, Human Papilloma Virus, HPV, as one example, is the leading cause of cervical cancer, which is a leading killer of Canadian women.)
Teen sex is an industry in Canada, an industry that has very little to do with the actual protection of our young people. It's a "therapeutic industry" whose propaganda alleges concern and help for our young people when, in reality, it tends to aid and abet their being sexually active, which then leads to disease and dysfunction, which then leads them straight into the arms of "therapeutic" agencies such as Planned Parenthood, public health units, etc.
Gaydom is right in there, aiding and abetting sexual activity in younger and younger people, sometimes referred to as "chicken" by older members of the fraternity. Rosalie Abella is the judge who lowered the age of consensual sex from 16 to 14 in Ontario, and in her defence of the change, she specifically named the gay community as a 'recipient' of the largesse of her judgment.
It is astonishing that for three per cent (3%) of our population (Alfred Kinsey's 10% was an outright fabrication, his stats and documentation having long ago been proven to be bogus) there have been so many accommodations made in our society. Most of these accommodations, including the lowering of consensual sex to 14 (a law which, hopefully, now is going to be changed), Gay Pride Week and parades, the legalization of same-sex marriage, gay picture books in elementary schools, hate speech legislation which discriminates against anyone who would make even substantiated negative claims against the gay community, do nothing to help young people live more healthy lives.
Gay sex leads to not just HIV and AIDs but to at least 50 other opportunistic diseases, and the hard reality is, that the life span of a sexually active Canadian gay man is 49 years, whereas the life span of a Canadian male not involved in gay sex is 76. Is this a lifestyle that we want to encourage our sons, nephews, and brothers to be a part of?
It's as though our moral universe has been turned upside down: Those encouraging sexual activity only inside marriage or, at the very least, not until oneÂ’s late teens are considered wrongheaded and retrograde, whereas those encouraging earlier and kinkier sex, either heterosexual or homosexual, are considered progressive and enlightened.
"Progressive" and "enlightened" sexuality leads to nothing but disease and heartache for our young people which should be enough for our society to encourage putting an end to it, something all past generations attempted to do. But it's not going to happen anytime soon, because entrenched and everything-to-lose special interest groups like Planned Parenthood, therapeutic agencies, and the gay lobby will see to it that anyone who proposes protection of our young people from engaging in teenaged sex is labelled "homophobic," "bigoted," "overly protective," "prudish," etc.
Canadians need to wake up to the reality many of their kids are facing. Parents, in particular, need to be vigilant of the sex ed. programs their children are subjected to in their schools and to speak up about some of the very unhealthy suggestions being made to them. It’s not comfortable to be a watchdog—that’s how I found out about what is really going on in our schools, by monitoring the sex ed. materials handed out in my children’s classrooms—but your child(ren)’s present and future health depends on it.
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 25, 2006 10:53 AM (Bjar7)
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Here's what Leonard Cohen has to say about times like these, from his song "The Future":
...Give me crack and anal sex
Take the only tree that's left
and stuff it up the hole of your culture
Give me back the Berlin Wall
Give me Stalin and St. Paul
I've seen the future, brother:
it is murder.
Things are going to slide, slide in all directions
Won't be nothing
Nothing you can measure anymore
The blizzard of the world
has crossed the threshold
and it's overturned
the order of the soul
When they said REPENT
I wonder what they meant
When they said REPENT
I wonder what they meant
When they said REPENT
I wonder what they meant...
(CD: "The Future," Columbia, 1992)
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 25, 2006 11:17 AM (Bjar7)
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This one's better:
The Second Coming
Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 25, 2006 11:31 AM (2cg9c)
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It's usual, Dr. Dawg, to acknowledge the author of such eloquent lines, in this case William Butler Yeats.
As to which one is "better," that's in the eye of the beholder... Certainly some rough beast, if not many, is slouching towards Bethlehem, and any way you look at the future, it's murder...
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 25, 2006 11:44 AM (Bjar7)
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I thought everybody knew who wrote that poem. Damned socialist education these days...
Posted by: Dr.Dawg at June 25, 2006 01:35 PM (2cg9c)
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The government had better define the laws on the protection of children from all forms of sexual abuse. There seems to be a lot of confusion out there. The new law states age of sexual consent is 16. The law for sodomy, anatomically, anal intercourse is supposedly 18. Unbelievably there are people saying these laws are against human rights, who's human rights ? It sure isn't against the children's human rights so we know where that cry is coming from......Perverts, pedophiles and the likes of recruiters like EGALE. Sickening.
Posted by: Liz Jackson at June 25, 2006 07:22 PM (Eoxl8)
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With institutions like the 'Liberal' appointed courts and education unions and academic departments under the effective power of the 'sexual identity' groups, it is an uphill battle to return so some semblance of social sanity in Canada. Consider 'Gale BC' (check the website) and that any educator crossing this lobby will be persecuted, and government does nothing to protect such a teacher's presumably enshrined human rights, consider the millions wasted by the Surrey School Bd and the amounts BCTF spent forcing the BD to do so, and you will appreciate that this agenda is not a sideline, but is a leading part of the 'Liberal' mindset and social engineering affecting the transformation of the canada we once knew and thought our own.
When Gale BC through their people in both administration and union break the law, the law cannot be enforced because the union retains the 'sole representation power' over all teachers in BC. Canada is not a democracy where essential human rights of due process are followed and unions are not held to their fiduciary duties by the state. Canada is a scam made for Gale BC etc to hold ultimate powers over ordinary normal people.
Posted by: hoff at June 25, 2006 11:09 PM (e/acA)
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From the inside, I can tell you that teachers' unions exist only for the comforts and 'privileges' of the teachers. I haven't heard one thing, once, at a union meeting, about the needs of our children/students. Just the incessant whining that we don't have enough prep time, equity with such and such a board, yada, yada, yada.
Teachers' unions are mouthpieces for the beast that is slouching/lurching towards Bethlehem, for the social engineers in the Librano Party, the Dippers, the feminists, the gay lobby, you fill in the blanks.
Canada is a Banana Republic, and one can only hope that PMSH and the CPC aren't too late to turn the whole sorry mess around. As Yeats put it so well:
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Canada's problem is not so much that the majority wants to see this social engineering become the norm; the majority doesn't. Our problem is that we have been so cowed by political correctness and so bullied by "the powers that be" (the academic, political, and media elites) that we've become a nation of wimps.
Wimps of Canada arise. You've nothing to lose but your chains.
If you don't stand up NOW, your children and grandchildren are doomed to a life of servitude.
Is this what our fathers, mothers, grandfathers, and grandmothers fought for in the two World Wars?
Posted by: new kid on the block at June 26, 2006 04:22 PM (Bjar7)
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Yes, "new kid", they do not represent the majority. Our quasi-democratic electoral system ensures that. Most 'one party state' 'Liberal' governments are elected by 40 percent of actual voters. Many are not on voters list. Of those who are on list, 60 percent have given up after a century of one party rule. Hence, all these 'social engineering from on high' policies skewing our country are passed by a 'majority' representing perhaps 20 to 25 percent of potential voters.
Like most virtual one party states, Canada has a state media organ, the CBC, that skews the information in often subtle, and when in crisis, not so subtle ways. The way Preston Manning was mocked by the CBC as a caricature of himself over ten years is but one example. Stirring up false conflicts that allow the 'Liberals' to emerge as 'the reasonable middle ground' is another.
A Byzantine bureaucratic and official ruling caste does not rule a country like Canada or Mexico for so long without having some expertise and some institutional levers in its favour. Undemocratic one party states and attendant ruling castes with control of the Justice system always use 'stability' and self-identification with 'the national identity' to justify their undemocratic and manipulative strategies and tactics. Also, they alway extract an incredible price in terms of wasted billions spent on their caste.
Posted by: hoff at June 27, 2006 02:37 PM (e/acA)
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"Get out of jail free" card
This is too subtle for me to understand:
The Supreme Court of Canada, in a judgment sure to spark political controversy, has refused to boost the sentence of one day in jail for a Winnipeg teenager who beat a man to death with a billiard ball wrapped in a sock.
In a 7-0 ruling Thursday, the court said the Youth Criminal Justice Act, as currently written, doesn't allow for increasing a sentence just to send a get-tough message to the public.
That seems to be true. The YCJA is not there to protect society, because society doesn't need to be protected from children:
The YCJA sets out distinct sentencing provisions for young persons which are different in important respects from the sentencing provisions for adults in the Criminal Code. Denunciation, specific deterrence, general deterrence, and incapacitation, which are sentencing objectives for adults under the Criminal Code, are not sentencing objectives under the YCJA.
In particular, the provisions under 718 of the criminal code do not apply to young offenders. For example, 718.1 reads:
718.1 A sentence must be proportionate to the gravity of the offence and the degree of responsibility of the offender.
So for a young offender, a sentence need not have any relation to the gravity of the offense, at least inasmuch as 718.1 is concerned.
There is one exception, 718.2(e), which deals with sentencing adult aboriginal offenders. This one portion of the sentencing guidelines in the Criminal Code is supposed to be considered when sentencing young aboriginal offenders. It's the section that reads "No jail!":
(e) all available sanctions other than imprisonment that are reasonable in the circumstances should be considered for all offenders, with particular attention to the circumstances of aboriginal offenders.
So if you are a young aboriginal who deliberately beats a man to death with a stick, you will not be subject to sentencing in proportion to the gravity of the offence, and in particular, the judge is required, by virtue of your aboriginal status, to make a concerted effort to come up with any sort of punishment that doesn't include imprisonment.
And yes, the case in front of the Supreme Court involved a 15-year-old aboriginal. A drunken young aboriginal who killed his victim slowly:
After exchanging heated words on a downtown doorstep in August 2002, the teen, who cannot be named, followed Chya Raup Saleh, 22, to his car. He smashed one of Saleh's car windows with the hidden billiard ball before using the makeshift weapon to strike Saleh in the head.
Saleh managed to drive himself back to his apartment where he was later found dead. An autopsy showed the cause of death to be blunt trauma to the head.
The teen, now 17, pleaded guilty to manslaughter even though he said he doesn't recall committing the crime because he was too drunk. He was sentenced to 15 months community service and one day in prison.
And what was the argument about?
[Saleh] apparently looked at the killer's sister the wrong way.
What? They weren't fighting about an ancient land claim? Colour me shocked.
Saleh was trying to earn enough money to bring his wife and parents to Canada from Iraq.
Anyone want to take bets on whether this young offender, being given the gift he has by the criminal justice system, will use his second chance, a chance denied to Saleh and the family that depended on him, to turn his life around and become yet another success story for the Youth Criminal Justice Act?
Didn't think so.
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Let me give you guys an insider view of the YCJA.
I am one of many Correctional Officers in a Young Offender facility in Ontario; or at least we USED to be. During the last Government's tenure we saw our job titles changed to "Youth Services Officer". That tells you exactly what our Liberal former Government's attitude was towards young offenders; that they be "serviced". We are are not even allowed to refer to them as "young offenders" when we report them for in-facility infractions. Now they are "young persons". What a farce!
Right now, the public is outraged at the coddling that young offenders are receiving in this pathetic excuse of a justice system. I tell you, for the most part the public and the people on this blog only know a minuscle fraction of the outrageous coddling that goes on in these facilities in the name of "justice". If you guys, and ESPECIALLY the victims knew the true extent (and I and many others have full memories of such numerous instances), many people would practically go insane at the thought and the justifications Ministry officials give to support all this coddling. Its too bad that I cannot give any specific examples, because we have to protect the right to privacy of these criminal thugs. But you guys know what I mean.
More and more stories are being reported of these young criminals; some of them robbers, rapists, and murderers serving jokes of a sentence and being released to live out the rest of their young lives; totally unconcerned and unfazed by the havoc they have wrought in their victim's lives. I speak from personal experience when I say that all most of them are concerned about when they are put in jail is getting out and getting on with THEIR lives. I have witnessed countless times how these unrepentant thugs manipulate the system to their advantage while many of the people who support the perpetuation of this system either look the other way, or are willfully blind to their machinations.
Too many of these repeat young offenders are receiving "alternative measures" in sentencing, and its a big joke to them as they get ready to graduate to adult jails. The Liberals have been crowing that youth crime stats went down during their watch. There are many reasons why they think they can claim this, however, its so misleading its sickening. Arrests were down because our brother police officers, who are likewise sickened by this injustice system, have their hands tied because they are forced to comply with this alternative measures nonsense. And those repeat offenders that are eventually brought to a judge are often given non-custody sentences or just let off in the "care" of their parents. Do you have any idea how many of these young offenders breach the conditions of these laughable sentences? I'd wager over 90% of the ones that finally receive custody sentences and come into our jurisdiction have breaches among their charges.
More and more are guilty of violent crimes. More and more are joining gangs. They don't care about counselling, they don't care about rehabilitation. They don't care about victims left in their wake. Hell, they don't even care if they go to jail, because they know for a fact its a collosal joke.
So is building more facilities and jailing them longer the right idea? Will it help stop youth crime? Maybe, maybe not. But one thing is for certain. It will take these thugs off the street.
Posted by: Correctional Grunt at June 22, 2006 02:11 PM (17sjr)
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Wow. That was a very insightful comment.
I too just want to express my outrage. How can we be said to value human life when a murder gets A DAY??? What human being past age 7 doesn't know killing is really wrong? Throw the kids in jail! Protect society!
Posted by: SUZANNE at June 22, 2006 02:44 PM (MoKZx)
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What kind of adults will we have when we have taught children that there are little or no consequences for their criminal actions? Is it a coincidence that youth crime seems to be escalating as the YCJA remains intact year after year? Or are kiddy-thugs getting bolder and bolder as they realize they can commit offences with impunity?
Brilliant post, Correctional Grunt.
Posted by: Steve A. at June 22, 2006 03:15 PM (x4k8S)
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This remains one of the reason why I hate Mulroney - He is the one who brought in this terrible Act in the first place.
It is time, once and for all, to get rid of this Act completely - forgot about adjusting it. It has been adjusted many times already.
Just how many additional crimes have been committed because the youth think they get a free pass and do get one - you can thank Mulroney.
Posted by: Gary McHale at June 22, 2006 03:18 PM (fdF5h)
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Gary:
http://lois.justice.gc.ca/en/Y-1.5/265283.html
The YCJA was assented to February 19, 2002 - long after Mulroney's tenure in office. This was not the Liberals tinkering with previous legislation but rather a social engineering failure on a much larger scale - i.e. a complete rewrite.
Posted by: Steve A. at June 22, 2006 05:16 PM (x4k8S)
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The reason that 718.1 seems not to apply to young offenders is that there is an automatic assumption with the law that people under the age of 18 are ultimately only minimally responsible for their actions. Little responsibility means that the proportion of punishment must be very small.
I should say, though, that I think it's this exact attitude towards children that causes so many problems in the first place, especially with repeat offenders. This guy was 13 years old when he murdered another human being. You cannot tell me that a 13-year-old doesn't understand life and death. Alcohol isn't an excuse for an adult, and it sure as hel shoudln't be one for someone who isn't supposed to be drinking in the first place.
Posted by: Stephen Williamson at June 22, 2006 06:08 PM (V/x/j)
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Frightening comments--welcome to Canada--a nation of thug-huggers. Isn't it odd that a child of 14 is old enough to be capable of consenting to sex but not old enough to understand murder is wrong?
As for sentencing--not only young offenders escape 'justice'--an ex soldier was absolved of responsibility for breaking into a 13 year old's bedroom and raping her--because he suffers from post traumatic stress disorder from serving in Bosnia. This is ludicrous but typical of the Canadian Injustice System. Is it too late to change it--I think so--the Court is filled with bleeding heart Liberals who view repeat offenders as a make work project--to hell with the victim--the perp is of utmost importance--they have 'rights'
Posted by: George at June 22, 2006 06:54 PM (ZXzuE)
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Steve A, I'm pretty sure Gary was referring to the Young Offenders Act, which was passed in 1984, and which was replaced by the YCJA. That original Act was the one that effectively blocked any criminal charges from being laid against offenders younger than 12. It laid out the same sort of principles that the YCJA has about using non-judicial procedures, and sets custody as a last resort option for sentencing.
I really don't see that a whole hell of a lot has changed from YOA to YCJA.
Posted by: Ian in NS at June 22, 2006 08:25 PM (tKrjN)
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Ian:
Just before the YCJA came into effect I had a friend in law enforcement voice their concerns that there would be an escalation in the magnitude of youth crime due to the act. Judging by the brazen public shootouts and our poolball sock toting friend, it looks like they were right. I would accordingly argue there is enough of a difference between the two acts.
I think the law should recognize that kids will sometimes do stupid things i.e. property damage, etc. Murder and rape, however, require a level of depravity that should not be excused. These kid-coddling laws should only apply to lesser crimes.
Posted by: Steve A. at June 23, 2006 08:57 AM (x4k8S)
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High Time to DRUG and ALCOHOL TEST all Judges, Politicians, Teachers, Cops, Civil Servants...to protect us all...even if it only stops a tear from falling from the cheek of ONE small child...after all, WE have to piss in a bottle to prove our sanity to hold down some dumbass job....
Posted by: Raymond Hietapakka at June 23, 2006 10:06 AM (Y1ykG)
Posted by: becky at July 05, 2006 03:52 PM (UjDVN)
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Ken Hill, Entrepeneur: Confirmed
The major media has finally reported Ken Hill's identity, weeks after the arrest warrant was issued:
Prominent Six Nations businessman Ken Hill has been arrested and charged with two counts of assault in connection with a fracas on a Caledonia street June 4.
Hill, 47, senior supply and marketing officer and 10 per cent shareholder in Ohsweken-based cigarette manufacturer Grand River Enterprises Six Nations Ltd., was arrested by the OPP in Cayuga yesterday morning without incident.
He will appear in Cayuga court July 19.
Hill is one of six people named in a batch of warrants issued for various charges by the OPP following three violent incidents around the native-occupied Douglas Creek Estates June 9.
An OPP spokesman said yesterday the charges against Hill relate to a pushing and shoving incident on Braemar Avenue between native protesters and Caledonia residents the night of June 4. There were no injuries.
The altercation at the barricade was sparked when an OPP vehicle which made a wrong turn onto the Sixth Line -- an agreed upon no-go zone for police -- was surrounded by natives and the officers inside were ticketed for trespassing.
Caledonia residents rushed to their side of the barricades and an altercation followed.
OPP spokesman Constable Dennis Harwood said Hill was arrested "at a Cayuga business" just after 7 a.m.
The report says Hill was arrested at a business location, while I was told it was a wedding. I doubt it matters much which.
Curious what business is open at 7am, though. Maybe he was picking up a pack of GRE smokes at the local 24-hour convenience store.
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Posted by: Gary McHale at June 22, 2006 11:22 AM (fdF5h)
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There are some items screaming for attention here, Angry.
1) Who in their right mind would allow a DMZ over a piece of disputed land in a subdivision?
2) Who in God's name allowed this to be a no police zone? Last I heard, they were supposed to have access to do their jobs.
3) The police were ticketed for accidentally trespassing in the DMZ?!?! Yet there is no legal action when passersby/media, etc are attacked and robbed?
Posted by: Dagny Taggart at June 22, 2006 12:25 PM (/WgcG)
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" an agreed upon no-go zone for police"
Interesting.
Posted by: virgil at June 22, 2006 02:45 PM (s8cdN)
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The importance of this has been exaggerated. The OPP and Six Nations Police have 17 years of experience working together well. At any normal time that people on sixth line were at risk, they would have been helped by the nearest officers. It has always been like that. Now it's just more difficult for OPP, so they're announcing to the community so they know who will answer their calls. However, it doesn't appear that there have been many.
Posted by: at June 25, 2006 01:05 AM (ae3LI)
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Ken Hill has been arrested
On the topic of Ken Hill, there has been quite a bit of discussion. There is a Ken Hill in the Six Nations reserve who, with Jerry and Art Montour, runs Grand River Enterprises, a cigarette concern. They seem to run "the gambling commission" on the reserve (internet gambling via the Six Nations Network) out of the GRE offices. Art Montour is also a leader of the Mohawk Warriors.
One question has centered on the identity of the Ken Hill wanted by the OPP on two counts of assault. I've been fielding a lot of emails from people who think I have different Ken Hills confused.
They point out that it seems unlikely that a major businessman, even one involved in less than wholesome businesses such as smoking and gambling, would be rioting at a barricade.
I voice the same doubts. But at the same time, I pointed out that if the real motive behind the Caledonia protest is to get their hands on partially developed land (at the expense of the Ontario taxpayer) to use as a site for a real bricks-and-mortar casino, then it seems reasonable to assume that Ken Hill might very well be on-site to protect his investment.
The link to Mohawk Warrior Art Montour via business partner Jerry Montour (all three made a joint donation to the Cruz Bustamante election campaign in California in 2003) helped bolster that theory. The Mohawk Warriors are known to be deeply involved in gambling interests (as well as the drug trade and cigarette smuggling), and are of course driving the protest.
I've been in touch with several people who assure me that this is indeed the same Ken Hill. One is based on a family link, the other via a recreational association. For now, I am happy to proceed with my original reasoning.
With that in mind, we have news of Ken Hill's arrest:
(Caledonia, ONT.) On June 21, 2006, the Ontario Provincial Police made an arrest related to an incident, which occurred in Caledonia on June 4, 2006 at approximately 9:45pm.
Charged with two counts of Assault is Ken Hill, age 47 of Ohsweken, Ontario.
The charges relate to an incident involving an alleged confrontation between the “occupiers” and Caledonia citizens near a barricade at the end of Braemar Ave. An investigation followed resulting in an arrest warrant being issued for Ken Hill. The accused was arrested at approximately 7:05am in Cayuga, Haldimand County without incident.
Ken Hill will appear in Cayuga court on July 16, 2006 to answer to the charges.
My sources tell me he was attending a wedding when he was picked up. Apparently, he was in the presence of members of the Six Nations Police, but the OPP came to execute the arrest warrant. It is not clear if the Six Nations Police helped or hindered justice in this case. They may indeed have brokered a deal to allow Hill to be picked up.
That deal might have included his subsequent release from custody. There is no report of a bond being posted. It might be that he is seen as an upstanding citizen who poses little flight risk.
That would surprise me. He is a member of the Six Nations Reserve and can cross the Canada-US border at will (the reserve spans the border), and so exit the reserve into US territory.
My mistake. The reserve does not span the border. I had a map of the Quebec reserves that figured in the news a fews back in my head. Sorry about that.
On the other hand, he might want to stay close to the site to oversee the archaeological dig.
Archaeological dig?
Another email to me says that large construction equipment has been moved onto the disputed land by the protesters. Apparently, it is for an archaeological dig.
Maybe they expect to uncover a casino!
Posted by: Steve Janke at
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Yes, any of us with even the most rudimentary knowledge of archeology knows that a bulldozer is MUCH better for the delicate work involved in archeoligical digs rather than a brush and hand spade...
I wonder why the first archeoligical survey found nothing? I guess their bulldozer was too small...
Posted by: James at June 22, 2006 09:50 AM (fmnZG)
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Archeological dig? Doubt it as a whisk is usually the tool of choice. Could have at least borrowed Daltons broom, but he is too busy using it.
Find a casino?..wouldn't bet on it. However, some cache????
Heard they were doing some geneological research to prove the existence of burial site. Might roll a few bones there.
Posted by: MadMacs of Bytown at June 22, 2006 10:19 AM (2oM75)
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They appear to digging some big holes with big equipment for it to be an Archeological dig. By the way, the site had already been investigated for Archeoligical reason before - nothing found.
For more info on Caledonia see:
www.CaledoniaWakeUpCall.com
Posted by: Gary McHale at June 22, 2006 11:45 AM (fdF5h)
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Can't you just hear the Randy Travis song "Diggin' Up Bones" to the drone of the bulldozer? Sacred burial grounds? Give me a break. They are laughing at and taking the rest of us for fools every time they pull these stunts and they do it because they can. We wouln't want to be labelled as racist now would we? The racist card is a wonderful tool for all manner of dissent and disgusting behaviour .
Posted by: Old Biddy at June 22, 2006 12:28 PM (zAMkm)
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To learn a lot more visit:
wwww.citizensofcaledonia.ca
Now dabbling Dalton and the rest of his crew will holiday in the Muskokas, Kawartha's or where ever. I only wish that a Native protest would establish itself bordering on his property. Most people not from Caledonia think all is calm. Every citizen of Ontario should take a drive to Caledonia and visit the neighbourhood who's fence abutts the occupation site. These people are living through hell. Bella Clava adorned warriors driving by on ATV's sporting machetes, Drums beginning at 11pm, seniors being harassed during the day by these terrorist. Knock on one of these peoples doors and ask if you can take a picture from there backyard. They will likely allow you to do so but a hand full of warriors may jump your fence to confiscate your camera. These people need help. Dalton has purchased the land and will hand it over to the Natives. The Liberals are now considering buying the properties of these people who border the site. What happens then? The natives will then take squatters rights in these houses and the rest of the neighbourhood will have to live through hell. Dalton get some balls and get these red terrorists of the land. Harper quit playing political games and do something if our Ontario Pencil Neck Premeir won't. Rumor has it they are planning now to take over the Caledonia Bridge in the center of town on Canada Day. If that happens anarchy will occur. Beleive me, it just won't be one person that dies. This will be far more then Ipperwash if nothing's done. Who will be the white Dudley George?
Posted by: JusticeforAll at June 22, 2006 09:38 PM (y6n8O)
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Read the following link to see what traditional Natives think of the Montours, Hill and Mohawk Warriors. Unfortunately most are to scared to speak out against them:
http://sixnations.buffnet.net/Threats_to_Traditional_Governments/
Posted by: IloveCanada at June 22, 2006 09:44 PM (y6n8O)
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Racism is racism regardless of which race representatives emit racism and racism is often hate speech and such as what has been posted here can qualify for this, and all of it, regardless of 'which side' it comes from, is odious and unacceptible.
'The land', belongs to God, the Creator, not natives or non-natives, and history can't be turned back to Napoleonic times in Europe or here in canada, and so we are all equal in opportunity born in one common generation regardless of race, and so all we can demand is equality befor the law regarding current history and equality before the economy regarding current opportunities we can all avail ourselves with.
Posted by: hoff at June 25, 2006 11:16 PM (e/acA)
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June 20, 2006
Pushing the North Koreans
The North Koreans and the US are might be getting ready to start shooting at each other, after a fashion:
The Pentagon activated its new U.S. ground-based interceptor missile defense system, and officials announced yesterday that any long-range missile launch by North Korea would be considered a "provocative act."
Two Navy Aegis warships are patrolling near North Korea as part of the global missile defense and would be among the first sensors that would trigger the use of interceptors, the officials said yesterday.
The U.S. missile defense system includes 11 long-range interceptor missiles, including nine deployed at Fort Greeley, Alaska, and two at Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif. The system was switched from test to operational mode within the past two weeks, the officials said.
One senior Bush administration official told The Washington Times that an option being considered would be to shoot down the Taepodong missile with responding interceptors.
Imagine if this plays out. If the Americans miss, the Pentagon will have to put up with a lot of abuse from Democrats on Capital Hill about the useless boondoggle that is ballistic missile defense. But I think the Pentagon is willing to ride out that storm for a chance at a real live test.
And the generals and admirals must be pretty confident to take the gamble.
Now imagine if the North Korean missile gets knocked down.
First, a lot of naysayers will have to rework their criticisms. And the Pentagon will have a lot of new friends willing to fund more missile work and other weapons systems.
But the real effect will be on North Korea.
There will be the loss of face when the missile is lost. Of course, the North Korean government will never admit to a failure to their own people, but other governments will know what happened.
Loss of face is one thing. Loss of revenue is something else. When potential customers for this missile see it blasted out of the sky by the American destroyers, you can be sure they will wonder if their defence dollars would be best spent on fighter jets from France. For North Korea and its moribund economy, a loss of hard currency from missile sales could be disastrous.
In fact, I wonder just how bad it could be. Could the loss of revenue destabilize the government? If Kim Jong Il perceives a real threat to his power if the missile is destroyed, what would he do?
Delay the test? More loss of face. And fewer sales could still result if potential customers see Kim Jr step back from taking on American missile defence.
Stop the Americans? How? Send a Romeo- or Whiskey-class submarine after the Aegis destroyers? The Romeos date from the 50s; the Whiskeys from the 1970s. The Whiskeys might not even work anymore (the North Koreans only had 4, compared to over 20 Romeos). In any case, it seems unlikely that the old subs would pose a real threat, especially if a modern American attack sub is lurking near the Aegis destroyers to defend against such an attack.
Maybe the North Koreans will have a better chance sending a squadron of their missile boats. A launch of multiple SS-N-2 Styx missiles would give even an Aegis destroyer reason to be worried. I doubt many of the patrol boats would survive to return to home port, but then Kim would lose little sleep over that.
Even an unsuccessful attack might disrupt a launch of the anti-missile missiles. Not likely, but the North Koreans have few options.
And that's really the problem. The North Koreans have few options about anything. Belligerence is the only language they can use, because they saw what happened when the Soviet Union opened up under Mikhail Gorbachev. And North Korea is in far worse shape today than the Soviet Union was in the 80s. They insist on pushing and pushing, because they know if they stop, they'll collapse. But even as they push, they are egging on others to push back. So far, most have resisted the temptation to push as hard they are capable of pushing, knowing that pushing too hard could ignite a war on the peninsula. But the North Koreans just keep on pushing.
Update: Looks like the North Koreans are trying to find a way not to fire the missile:
North Korea said Wednesday it wants direct talks with the United States over its apparent plans to test-fire a long-range missile, a day after the country issued a bristling statement in which it declared its right to carry out the launch.
Tensions in the region have soared following intelligence reports that the North was fueling a ballistic missile believed capable of reaching U.S. territory. The United States and Japan have said they could consider sanctions against the impoverished state and push the U.N. Security Council for retaliatory action should the launch go ahead.
North Korea said in comments published Wednesday that its self-imposed moratorium on testing long-range missiles from 1999 no longer applies because it's not in direct dialogue with Washington, suggesting it would hold off on any launch if the U.S. agreed to new talks.
I don't think the sanctions worry the North Koreans too much. The fact is that sanctions can be busted, especially when there are governments out there more than happy to do anything that messes with US policy. Yeah, Iran, I'm looking at you. But having the missile knocked out of the sky by an American defence system? And a relatively immature fefence system at that? Kim Jong Il might simply be unwilling to take that risk, and is looking for a way out.
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If it works the argument will be that we don't need to spend any more money on it because it works.
Posted by: Farmer Joe at June 20, 2006 09:50 PM (zHlQZ)
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News today is that the missile test is to be delayed.
Did Lil'Kim blink?
Posted by: gimbol at June 21, 2006 06:20 AM (uDj9I)
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BMD is one of those things. I hope it works, but there's no reason to believe that it does.
Posted by: Bowie at June 21, 2006 11:30 AM (OO9+l)
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You forgot one option about where they would get their $$$
Selling fully operational nukes...That would get them a pretty penny if they had no other option.
Sell a few to Iran, sell a couple to al queda.
That shoudl keep KimPossible from feeling lonely for quite awhile. Scarey thought
Posted by: Stephen at June 21, 2006 06:41 PM (wtbPM)
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Come on North Korea....talk is cheap. Money talks, bullshit walks. Make the American's day. Push the friggin "Fire" button! Chickenshit communist Korean-bully trash talkers.
Posted by: Ross at June 21, 2006 07:49 PM (Y1ykG)
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Chances are that the interceptors work. The Pentagon wouldn't put them out there if they didn't, otherwise someone's butt would be in a sling when it failed, and Generals don't like to look bad.
Talks with North Korea would be a waste of time. I don't think Bush would even consider direct negotiations without the other nations in the area involved. This is just more crap from the little bully.
It's about time that someone stood up to North Korea and made them behave. For too long, everyone has tolerated them like the crazy uncle in the basement. North Korea can be a serious threat to the world, and definitely Japan. That would be bad for business, after all, where would we get our cars and electronics from? MY GOD! A world without big screen tv's and video games! Perish the thought!!
Posted by: cincimaddog at June 23, 2006 03:04 PM (3Ck1Z)
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June 19, 2006
But does Stephane Dion really suck?
Does Stephane Dion's executive assistant know something about the suckiness of Stephane Dion that he plans to share with us one day? Or is he protecting his boss from charges of suckiness he expects to be leveled against Stephane Dion in the near future?
more...
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I think this whole thing s**ks. Stinks too.
Or, perhaps there is a deeper meaning in the word "sucks" that Mr. Cairo is trying to convey.
Posted by: Hate-these-Name-Boxes at June 19, 2006 06:27 PM (8gTnS)
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You are stretching Steve.
Our company has a number of websites including mis-spellings of its name. Doesn't mean we can't spell our company's name. We are just covering our bases.
Sounds like Dion's crew is doing the same with what matters most to them.
Posted by: Kathryn in Canada at June 19, 2006 08:16 PM (P+Lxf)
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Simple -- they've registered it so that nobody else can.
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2006 12:36 AM (C/3FW)
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I think you're right, anonymous, but then just why one variation? When a movie company reserves a domain name for an upcoming release, they reserve a dozen or more variations on average.
That's what struck me as odd. Same comment to Kathryn. Covering bases makes sense. But covering exactly one base only?
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 20, 2006 02:38 AM (beWVc)
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Oh yeah, and why the different emails and whatnot? Just wondering...
Posted by: Steve Janke at June 20, 2006 05:59 AM (beWVc)
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With a hotmail address I would think this may be someone faking the name/email to cause trouble for Dion.
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 20, 2006 10:24 PM (Xiqvi)
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Rolling up the troublemakers
Remember Audra Ann Taillefer, the woman from Victoria, BC, an exp-prostitute, whose goal in life was to be a positive role model for aboriginal youth?
She had decided that inducing heart attacks in elederly white males constituted a positive example.
She was one of the seven people wanted in relation to the violence in Caledonia. Well, she was picked up:
(Caledonia, ONT.) On Friday, June 16, 2006, Six Nations Police acting on an arrest warrant has made an arrest relating to a June 9th incident. The Six Nations Police transferred custody of the accused to the Haldimand County OPP Detachment.
Charged with Intimidation and Robbery is Audra Ann Taillefer, age 45 of Victoria, British Columbia.
The charges are in relation to an incident that took place before noon involving an elderly couple from Simcoe who were visiting the Caledonia area. An altercation occurred between themselves and the “occupiers” resulting in an elderly male victim being taken to West Haldimand General Hospital in Hagersville as a precaution.
Audra Ann Taillefer will appear in Cayuga Court to answer to her charges.
No word on whether she was spotted by police, she turned herself in, or if someone ratted her out.
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Luckily, in Ontario, you voted in "Iron Fist" McWimpy, who is putting his foot down on this illegal occupation issue. There'll be no more negotiating until the band turns over the criminal elements they're hiding.... Refuse to turn them over? Well, then.......ok, we'll buy up the land you sold to give back to you....but this is the FINAL stand...... Certainly........ For sure...... Yes, I'm sure this is it.....
Posted by: Rob R at June 19, 2006 12:51 PM (y9Fs6)
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she's guilty! ooops, wait, we're canadian. we only assume she's guilty until the state can proved she's innocent. no, wait, that's the french system. she's innocent until proven guilty isn't it? no, that's 'merican. sheesh, who cares, she's indian, let's dis her anyway and move on maybe some cowboys got a grudge.
plenty o them around. i thought better of you steve.
Posted by: Ottawa Core at June 19, 2006 01:07 PM (YK+v9)
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When I saw that she was from Victoria, British Columbia I had some real concerns that she was arrested in BC. Then I noted that she was appearing in Cayuga Court and I was relieved. In BC they would have just told her not to do it again and handed her the complimentary bag of weed for her trip home.
Posted by: Angry Canadian at June 19, 2006 01:25 PM (f7z9E)
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OC
Get over it. Of course she'll have her dau in court. Of course, her day in court will be protested by the "Warriors". Of course, she'll get a slap on the wrist.
The question to ask might be, "What sort of evidence was required for her arrest to proceed in the first place?" I'm guessing that the presiding judge must have been present and witnessed the crime, after which she approached him, stated her name and showed him three forms of photo ID.
Posted by: Rob R at June 19, 2006 01:36 PM (y9Fs6)
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OC:
That 6 nations even bothered to turn her over tells me something.
How much respect can you have for your own people as they dole out the suspects as political capital. They either are not under Canadian law or they are. Sorry , but any which way I look at this situation it just plain reeks with hypocrisy on both sides.
Posted by: Fergy at June 19, 2006 02:13 PM (gnGgU)
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did anyone ever consider that just because you are of a particular race, let's say WHITE, every last one of you is JUST LIKE THE OTHER!
now, if that's the way i read youse guys, that's about par for the course. on the other hand, if a person is not known by anything more than their race it would take a little bit of restraint to not express yourselves so racially.
the rumour mill can debilitate just about everyone who cannot defend themselves. can you show me a propensity of proof that supports either of your contentions that if you are native you get off scot free? i will await for your learned perspective.
Posted by: Ottawa Core at June 19, 2006 08:54 PM (YK+v9)
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Fry that scumbag whore. No more breaks for aboriginal 'protesters'.
Posted by: D-Man at June 19, 2006 10:41 PM (b8I0n)
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In an opposition state of mind
It looks like the Liberals are starting to settle into the long-term role of opposition:
Joe Volpe is spoiling to be the bad boy of the otherwise polite and low-key Liberal leadership race, now accusing his rival Michael Ignatieff of sharing the same politics as Prime Minister Stephen Harper.
At the second leadership debate, in Moncton yesterday, Volpe pointedly singled out Ignatieff in his opening remarks, waving a newspaper headline about his views on Canada's role in Afghanistan, and arguing that only Harper would agree with the former Harvard law professor.
Volpe did it deliberately and unapologetically, declaring to reporters later about Ignatieff's debate performance: "I only heard Harper's narrative."
Volpe doesn't have to agree with Ignatieff. I'd be surprised if the two of them agreed on much of anything. But when you measure the validity of the other's position only by how much it resembles someone else's, then it follows that you don't have any arguments of your own. For Volpe, Stephen Harper is Volpe's argument.
And that puts Stephen Harper in control, at least inasmuch as Volpe is concerned.
Remember the first Liberal budget after the 2004 election? The Conservatives voted in support of it because it contained enough elements that they agreed with. That it was from Paul Martin did not change that fact. After Martin changed the budget as the price for NDP support, many of those elements were removed, and the Conservatives withdrew their support. Again, consistent with the objective reality of the budget document. Stephen Harper kept his emotional reaction, his distaste for the Liberal Party and whatever personal animosity that he held for Paul Martin, in check.
Joe Volpe, on the other hand, seems to have been reduced to nothing but emotional reactions.
I'm not the only one who has noticed:
Other leadership candidates don't seem pleased about Volpe's performance or even his presence in the race.
Former public health minister Carolyn Bennett, also among 11 vying for the leadership title, said her views fall smack in the middle of rival Bob Rae, a former Ontario premier, and Ignatieff on the question of Afghanistan.
But on Volpe's provocation, she is unequivocal, saying he is becoming a problem for the contest and the party's reputation overall.
"I'm concerned that this is not what this (contest) is supposed to be about," she said, arguing Volpe was already tarred enough by the controversy over accepting $5,400 contributions from teenagers.
On the question of Volpe being a problem for the party's reputation, it has to be said that he isn't making things worse. The Liberal repution is already in tatters. He is delaying the recovery, perhaps, but then that might be giving Volpe too much credit.
What I do think is significant is that for Volpe and an unknown number of Liberal supporters, the notion that "Conservative = Bad" is an attractive one. It requires minimal mental calculation to come to a conclusion, it lends itself to a standard template for insults, and it is emotionally satisfying.
It is also useless, since any voter who is not a dyed-in-the-wool Liberal will wonder whether the Liberals have anything more to offer than Conservative-bashing. If Volpe or someone like him wins, it will be a while before the Liberals do.
That's fine by me.
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It is so typical of the liberal (and NDP) to cater to the "lowest common denominator)hence Volpe's approach to the leadership contest. What was that line from Forrest Gump, "Stupid is as stupid does."
Posted by: Dave at June 19, 2006 09:55 AM (xoXVY)
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I am afraid that's all they have to offer at this point - Volpe, at least. I don't trust Volpe. I am sure there is a lot more in that man's past that we don't even know about yet. He strikes me as dirty and corrupt. Any party would be better off without him.
Posted by: Werner Patels at June 19, 2006 09:59 AM (/V2m6)
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The epiphany for Ignatief is learning that the Liberal Party he left 30 years ago no longer exists. His tone and speeches take up from where the party was in the '60s. Volpe is a mouth-breathing, knuckle-dragging example of where the party has descended to in Ignatief's absence. Liberals have been so badly co-opted by leftist statists they have to look behind themselves to see the future. Manley and McLellan have got their hooks in the Liberal "renewal" process, pretty much guaranteeing the Liberal status quo if anybody but Ignatief gets it. And if Ignatief gets it, he'll find himself in charge of a well populated day-care centre.
Posted by: Skip at June 19, 2006 10:07 AM (HK7Ah)
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Want to know why they want Volpe out of the race?
Because as long as he's gunning for Iggy, it makes it that much harder to make a deal for your delegates in return for future considerations.
To understand fully, recall the spectre of Craig Chandler in the last federal PC convention leadership race juxtapositioned next to Scott Brison. Scott's options where severly reduced when Craig (with all his Reform and socon baggage he entailed) gave his support to one of the front runners...guilt by association....forget about first ballot wins.
As long as Joe keeps gunning for the perceived front runner, forget about first ballot wins.
First ballot wins are essential if you want to present the illusion of a united party.
Posted by: gimbol at June 19, 2006 12:39 PM (uDj9I)
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Volpe is a poor example to put forward as a possible leader, even for the liberal party and he proved it when he ventured into kiddyland to troll for bucks. Then he lied. Telling us the kids were so impressed with his speech they were wondering how they could help him. The guy oozes all that's been ailing the liberal party pre and post Gomery. I wouldn't trust him to look after a canary. If he has any sway in the liberal party it will be to their detriment.
Posted by: Old Biddy at June 19, 2006 05:48 PM (FGBfq)
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I thought that the conservatives abstained to allow it to pass, rather than voted yea.
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2006 12:50 AM (C/3FW)
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FDLMAO... "Volpe is a mouth-breathing, knuckle-dragging ..." I though they
all were in the leadership race. Iggy has the best chance to distance
himself from the party though and to position himself as pre
Treaudo...having left the country for 30 years... he can't be linked to the
scandal rich Lib's of the last 15-30 years. I don't really like the guy as
he's more an academic type rather then one of real person experiences of the last 30 years of Canada's growth and developement, but
he's a damn site better then Volpe... He's probably their best chance at a
come back within 6 years... regardless, who ever they select better be ready
to sit in opposition for 4 years cause when all the dirt comes out it's
going to get nasty... If Iggy gets in and cleans house it's their only
hope... and he'll have to get rid of the contenders he defeats as well
because from their actions during this leadership race there are far too
many quotable quotes to use against these clowns in the next election...
Posted by: MrEd at June 21, 2006 12:50 AM (8C0v5)
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Only in Canada you say - Are these the only people in a country of 30 million who qualify to become a possible Prime Minister?
Michael Ignatieff - who so loved Canada that he spent the last 30 years in the USA
Joe Volpe - who believes that 11 years olds should be allowed to contribute $5400.00 of their hard earned money to his campaign.
Bob Rae - A failure as a Premier of Ontario and now wants to be promoted to Prime Minister so that he can put Canada even further in debt as he did Ontario.
Scott Brison - A turncoat - interested in only Scott Brison. Having been caught passing inside information to his investment broker friends makes one wonder how often this was done in the past and if he got to be leader how often (in a more sutle way) he would do the same again.
Stephane Dion - Surely not another Quebecor
The saddest part is that the media in general make such a fuss over whether a candidate can speak French. They are in effect ruling out about 80 % of Canadian residents. I'm sure that within that 80% there would be far superior people who
would make exceptional Prime Ministers. What other country would set a standard that the only criteria to qualify as Head of Country is that you speak two languages (French and English).
Posted by: Alonzo at June 21, 2006 09:09 AM (E0G58)
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June 17, 2006
A tax grab makes for a Conservative opportunity
Stephen Harper's Conservatives have an opportunity here:
The GST cut is not coming to City of Toronto facilities, programs, parking lots or cabs.
Everything from golf courses to dance classes, recycling boxes to museum admissions will not be cheaper when the GST falls to 6% from 7% on July 1.
Instead, the city will pocket the extra cash.
That's because city staffers are recommending that reducing the GST isn't worth the change.
"Unbelievable," John Williamson of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation said yesterday. "This is meant to be a tax cut that benefits all taxpayers across the country, not go into the pockets of governments."
To reduce the GST, the city would have to change billing systems, websites and printed publications to reflect the new, slightly lower fees, staff reported.
It might also force an amendment to the municipal code or other bylaws.
OK, so even though the Conservative government in Ottawa will charge only 6% for the GST, Toronto will continue to levy a 7% surcharge, send 6% to Ottawa, and keep the 1% for itself.
Now this brings up some interesting questions.
Will the receipts be changed to show this breakdown? I doubt it. The complaint seems to be that it would be too difficult to change things. So I suppose when the City of Toronto bills you for a service, it will still show 7% GST.
Is that a case of fraudulent billing? In principle, I could charge 20% GST, blaming Ottawa, and secretly keep 14% for myself. Of course, no one would fall for that, but then Mayor David Miller expects us to fall for exactly this sort of chicanery.
Doesn't the principle of transparency in government require the City of Toronto to explain exactly how the taxes are being charged? Shouldn't they be honest about which taxes are which, and even more important, report them accurately on paperwork? Such as on receipts printed by billing systems, on websites, and on printed publications?
Is this even legal? The City cannot levy a general sales tax -- it is not within the taxation power. The City can set property taxes, and charge municipal taxes on alcohol served restaurants and bars, and on movie and entertainment tickets. Those powers are granted by the provincial government. A general sales tax can only be levied by the federal and provincial governments. But by not changing the tax collected, the City has essentially created a 1% goods and services tax for itself.
That's just wrong.
Can 1% have an effect? This from the Canadian Restaurant and Foodservices Association on the issue of the alcohol tax:
In the City of Toronto alone, it is estimated that licensee sales will decrease by $2.95 million for every 1% of municipal sales tax applied to liquor.
Of course, the CRFA has a particular point of view, but it seems pretty obvious that not lowering the tax on city goods and services eliminates a major area for city-wide savings for businesses and residents. Those businesses, of course, will not be able to pass on the full force of the GST cut to consumers as long as they are shouldering the old tax rate on anything they get from the City.
I think the City of Toronto has no choice but to recalculate the taxes being charged. If it wants to increase the base price of all goods and services it provides by 1%, it certainly can do that, but then it must explain to the voters why it is doing that. And that to me seems no less difficult than lowering the tax charged by 1%.
How can this be stopped? A business can try to take on City Hall in court, but then that business would shoulder the cost of fighting for a benefit everyone, including competitors, would enjoy. So I don't think any would be quick to volunteer.
But I know who can take on City Hall on behalf of all Toronto residents. The federal government. If the City continues to print materials and hand out receipts claiming that Ottawa is charging 7% GST, and is pocketing the 1% difference, the federal government certainly has an interest in correcting the situation, for three good reasons.
First, the City is attributing a higher tax rate to Ottawa than Ottawa is actually charging, and that can be construed as libel.
Second, the City is effectively levying a goods and services tax, which is not in its power to do. Other levels of government have an interest in making an example of Mayor David Miller and his administration. It sends a message to other municipalities to play by the rules and to be honest.
Third, and perhaps most important, the Conservatives have a wonderful opportunity to show voters in Toronto, who elected no Conservatives in the last election, that the Conservatives care about them. What better way than to fight for lower taxes on their behalf. Might result in a few seats the next time around.
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1
Great post! I am certainly going to check out how they structure their billing on July 1st. If they are still charging a 7% GST, that must be against the law, and if they are not, their arguament - that they don't want to waste the time changing their systems - is obviously a fraud.
Posted by: Andrew Smith at June 17, 2006 12:43 PM (BPIr2)
2
that is highly ellegal that is like me not paying my incometax at the end of the year except in bigger portions. they can solve this problem bye raising there provincial tax and keeping the gst at 1 percent then there putting more into the province. but if I were to avoid paying my taxes on something I am buying I would go to jail.
Posted by: Roy Elsworth at June 17, 2006 01:00 PM (cqLEk)
3
Is anyone surprised by this? Each and every place that includes GST in the price, government or private business, will not lower their prices.
For example, I guarantee you that movie theatre pricess will remain unchanged.
Gov't, business. It doesn't matter. They want as much money as they can get their hands on. Screw the consumer.
I'm a pro-business Tory but even I'm starting to get sick of getting screwed around.
Posted by: sean at June 17, 2006 01:09 PM (z8naz)
4
Steve, I will be getting my 1% back either in payment or in legal fees. I intent to visit a museum this summer and if the City of Toronto policy does not change, I will be suing them in small claims court. It's cheap and easy for me to do and the city has to defend itself or pay up. I urge anyone who wants to stop Miller and his idiots at Toronto City Hall to join me. Let's Officially Screw them back!!!! Visit my site to join the fight!
Posted by: TrustOnlyMulder at June 17, 2006 02:57 PM (Xiqvi)
5
You know there are many people who do busness with small mom and pop operations. GST and PST Tax is often optional at those places depending on whether or not you pay cash.
I think it's time to do as much of your business as possible with those places to offset some of the government tax gouge that we have endured for too long.
Go Underground Economy Go!
Try it ... it's small revenge and I am told it really feels good.
Posted by: Duke at June 17, 2006 03:43 PM (kMQ/N)
6
"that a case of fraudulent billing?"
I believe it is and if it is then is it not also a criminal offense for a group of people to be planning to keep out an act of fraud?
I do not believe City Hall is above the criminal code so when they vote to keep the extra 1% then should they not all be charged by the police - not OPP (they appear unable to lay criminal charges)?
By the way, it cost $75 for anyone to file small claims against the City for the 1%. Yes it is more than what you will receive back but is it not important for governments to learn that people will not accept these things anymore?
You could also sue for $500 to recover 1% GST and lost wages due to time in court. You will never win the lost wages but I am sure the City will not paid $10,000+ to argue in court that they own only $1.20 - they will settle out of court for a few hundred (less than one hour of lawyers' fees to the city).
No court will uphold the City's right to charge the wrong GST rate.
Posted by: Gary McHale at June 17, 2006 03:53 PM (CdxYW)
7
Duke states we all should get involved in the Underground Economy.
Although I understand the reason for it, to suggest to people to take part in criminal activities as a way to get back at the government appears to me to be immoral - the very thing people like Duke say they are against when government do these types of things.
And if Duke believes it is okay for people to be involved in criminal activities because of whatever reason then why a government employee cannot be justified in lying and stealing from us because he has a reason that sound correct to him?
Posted by: Gary McHale at June 17, 2006 03:59 PM (CdxYW)
8
I'm a little hazy on the details, but some people are telling me that the "City of Toronto Act" that McGuinty passed (without notice or consent of course) somehow gives the city the right to levy a sales tax. Can anyone comment on that?
If that's true, my thoughts would be that the Province of Ontario has no legal standing to bestow that right upon any city; the Federal government may have delegated the right to levy a sales tax to Provincial governments, but I don't think that right would be transferrable.
Anyway, maybe I'm wrong about the CoT act in which case it's a moot point. But if not, then Harper will be the *only* person who can put a stop to this, because municipal and provincial courts will follow the letter of provincial law.
Also, people are saying that businesses aren't going to lower the prices, but that doesn't really make sense. The list prices of goods don't include GST - that's added on later. Unless those people are suggesting that businesses all intend to RAISE the list prices of their goods and services by 1%, you *will* pay less as a customer. And I doubt that every business will raise their prices, because unlike with governments, consumers have the option to take their business elsewhere.
Posted by: Aaron G at June 17, 2006 05:14 PM (1xiB4)
9
I look forward to the sound of silence emanating from Toronto city hall when the topic of a "deal for cities" is discussed.
The room has been created, they kept it, now some of the excuses are gone. It is now up to the citizens of Toronto to find a responsible council and mayor
Posted by: Stephen at June 17, 2006 06:17 PM (upnxu)
10
More Whining From Bigots
Much pantspissing and whining in blogosphere this week about the failure to indict.
I speak, of course, of More Whining From Bigots
Much pantspissing and whining in blogosphere this week about the failure to indict.
I speak, of course, of
"Captain" Ed Morrisey, who, blogging from his hospital bed, applies his double-digit i.q. to the case of Representative Cynthia McKinney.
First, the story:
A grand jury has declined to indict Rep. Cynthia McKinney of Georgia for allegedly striking a Capitol police officer in March, the federal prosecutor announced Friday.
The decision ends a case against the DeKalb County Democrat that has been rife with political and racial tensions.
"It is right, just and appropriate," McKinney's attorney, William Moffitt, said of the decision, which he learned about from reporters. "I'm ecstatic."
McKinney, arriving Friday night for the Boost Mobile Rock Corps concert at Atlanta's Fox Theatre, entered without responding to reporters's [sic] questions.
The decision comes more than two months after the Washington Superior Court grand jury was first given the case. U.S. Attorney Ken Wainstein called the investigation by his office and Capitol police "extensive and thorough."
"We respect the decision of the grand jury in this difficult matter," Wainstein said in a statement.
Now, the bloated blogger (warning -- link to an idiot):
In the meantime, someone should get a copy of the dictionary to the grand jury and a Toastmasters club membershio [sic] for the US attorney. If someone hits a police officer with a cell phone while he is performing his duties, and witnesses and even the suspect confirms it, how can that not rise to the level of "probable cause"?
How? Let me count the ways: Accident, lack of intent, self-defense, reasonable self-defense.
Poor, stupid dumbfuck. He simply can't understand that the unverified crap he reads on NewsMax and Instacracker and the drivellings of his commenters isn't a substitute for actual evidence. Of course, Special Ed wasn't present at the incident, doesn't know what evidence was presented and doesn't know what the grand jury knew or thought. But that doesn't stop the dumbfuck from suggesting the grand jury was too Negroid to understand the law and the facts: "Race baiting was the only defense McKinney could offer," says the dishonest seaman stain.
Of course, Ed's commenters take the hint and join in the hate parade:
I think James Joyner at OTB hit the nail on the head, reminding us that, "
his is the same jury pool that acquitted Marion Berry on two sets of felony charges and then reelected him twice."
----------------------
And they wonder why we don't treat them with respect.
I doubt "they" wonder that at all.
p.s. to doubleplus dumbfuck James Joyner: Marion Berry is a U.S. Representative from Arkansas, not the former Mayor of D.C. And I won't even bother to point out all the other inaccuracies in the single sentence, "This is the same jury pool that acquitted Marion Berry on two sets of felony charges and then reelected him twice. "Captain" Ed Morrisey, who, blogging from his hospital bed, applies his double-digit i.q. to the case of Representative Cynthia McKinney.
First, the story:
A grand jury has declined to indict Rep. Cynthia McKinney of Georgia for allegedly striking a Capitol police officer in March, the federal prosecutor announced Friday.
The decision ends a case against the DeKalb County Democrat that has been rife with political and racial tensions.
"It is right, just and appropriate," McKinney's attorney, William Moffitt, said of the decision, which he learned about from reporters. "I'm ecstatic."
McKinney, arriving Friday night for the Boost Mobile Rock Corps concert at Atlanta's Fox Theatre, entered without responding to reporters's [sic] questions.
The decision comes more than two months after the Washington Superior Court grand jury was first given the case. U.S. Attorney Ken Wainstein called the investigation by his office and Capitol police "extensive and thorough."
"We respect the decision of the grand jury in this difficult matter," Wainstein said in a statement.
Now, the bloated blogger (warning -- link to an idiot):
In the meantime, someone should get a copy of the dictionary to the grand jury and a Toastmasters club membershio [sic] for the US attorney. If someone hits a police officer with a cell phone while he is performing his duties, and witnesses and even the suspect confirms it, how can that not rise to the level of "probable cause"?
How? Let me count the ways: Accident, lack of intent, self-defense, reasonable self-defense.
Poor, stupid dumbfuck. He simply can't understand that the unverified crap he reads on NewsMax and Instacracker and the drivellings of his commenters isn't a substitute for actual evidence. Of course, Special Ed wasn't present at the incident, doesn't know what evidence was presented and doesn't know what the grand jury knew or thought. But that doesn't stop the dumbfuck from suggesting the grand jury was too Negroid to understand the law and the facts: "Race baiting was the only defense McKinney could offer," says the dishonest seaman stain.
Of course, Ed's commenters take the hint and join in the hate parade:
I think James Joyner at OTB hit the nail on the head, reminding us that, "his is the same jury pool that acquitted Marion Berry on two sets of felony charges and then reelected him twice."
----------------------
And they wonder why we don't treat them with respect.
I doubt "they" wonder that at all.
p.s. to doubleplus dumbfuck James Joyner: Marion Berry is a U.S. Representative from Arkansas, not the former Mayor of D.C. And I won't even bother to point out all the other inaccuracies in the single sentence, "This is the same jury pool that acquitted Marion Berry on two sets of felony charges and then reelected him twice."
Posted by: at June 17, 2006 06:25 PM (/elzC)
11
Calgary is doing the same thing, ass boys.
http://bigcitylib.blogspot.com/2006/06/toronto-and-calgary-will-keep-proceeds.html
Probably alot of other municipalities will follow their lead.
Posted by: bigcitylib at June 17, 2006 07:17 PM (zfDNY)
12
Bronconnier, the mayor of Calgary, is a Liberal--so he probably feels he is helping the Liberal cause along--of course--I didn't know the Liberals had a cause other than filling their own pockets.
This is the Liberals in action pure and simple--I can hardly wait for someone with the smarts to take the respective cities on--this should be illegal in any decent world--when will we say enough is enough? This is a tax break for everyone, albeit a small one--it is a federal tax, not a provincial or municipal one so by rights the cities should have no say in continuing it.
Posted by: George at June 17, 2006 08:05 PM (FJzXT)
13
BigCityLib, you are such a fucking homophobe.
Posted by: Joe Schmoe at June 17, 2006 09:56 PM (sATGg)
14
A 1% money grab is nothing. Municipal government services are probably at least 80% waste and corruption, with the remaining 20% or so of actual services inevitably delivered late, of low quality or not even needed.
The salaries and benefits are too high. The contracts are padded and the selection process is corrupt. The services are designed to win special-interest votes and secure political donations and campaign workers, and not to do anything that the average taxpayer wants. The results that are achieved are usually the opposite to the intended results, partly because of sheer, collective and unanswerable stupidity, but also because when a government program makes things worse, this opens the door to raising taxes, raising spending, raising salaries, and getting even more of one's friends onto the municipal payroll.
Dithering about a 1% tax grab is like complaining that the elephant sitting on your chest has bad breath. The issue is not "how much GST are they charging on their services", it is "how did we get sucked in so badly to this disgraceful and corrupt socialist miasma, and how can we possibly get out again?"
Posted by: at June 17, 2006 10:29 PM (a0Sy/)
15
This only applies to the remainder of 2006. In 2007 the city will make the adjustments.
Miller added the refund is only a problem this year because the cut in the GST comes halfway through the fiscal year.
Next year, he said, city fees will be recalculated to reflect the new rate.
http://www.insidetoronto.ca/to/scarborough/story/3552353p-4104012c.html?loc=scarborough
Posted by: Robert McClelland at June 17, 2006 10:30 PM (Akj8G)
16
cheat cheat and cheat this what i doing and elet them find ....and they never do so cheat every time ...buy cigs an reserve, buy beer in us and cheat always but if you stupid.....pay
Posted by: george at June 18, 2006 01:01 AM (nHj8W)
17
It's a small point but since the GST is charged at point of sale, reducing the actual GST to 6% but charging 7% is also defrauding the Federal Government. The value of the goods has in effect gone up 1%, so the amount of GST should be ((x) + (x*.01))*.06, not ((x)*.07)-((x)*.01).
We also need to keep in mind that this is just the first installment of the Conservative plan. So the municipalities and other institutions are going to follow this "lazy" route from now on?
Talk about equilization by another name.
Posted by: john at June 18, 2006 05:50 AM (3usbu)
18
My point is that the 1% not remitted to the Federal Government is itself subject to GST, thereby increasing taxes. A tax cut that raises taxes. Only a Liberal could be that devious!
The Toronto Parking Commission has stated that by not changing the GST it charges, they will pick up $80000. They will now owe an additional $480 to the Feds.
Posted by: john at June 18, 2006 06:00 AM (3usbu)
19
I do have some sympathy for places like Tim Horton's. Many of their prices are calculated to make life at the drive-thru simpler so that the price with tax ends up being say, $1.25. What are they to do? Charge $1.24 and have pennies flying all over the place?
Posted by: Tom at June 18, 2006 06:47 AM (SXfde)
20
I have no problem with the City keeping the extra, just as I dont have trouble with the federal government reducing taxes to create room and the provinces taking the "tax room".
That is a more honest way of taxing the citizenry rather than the sheel game of equalization, then you know who is taxing you and you can figure out if they really are delivering.
Now the debate over the right levels of taxation are a different matter. So once again, Mr Miller and his band of merry mayors can stop going cap in hand to the federal government. Along with the lack of accountability that brings it is also jumping the cue, municipalities are creatures of the provinces and arent even recognized constitutionally....of course sir john a referred to the provinces as glorified municipalities....but that is another story.
Posted by: Stephen at June 18, 2006 07:17 AM (upnxu)
21
quote:
to suggest to people to take part in criminal activities as a way to get back at the government appears to me to be immoral
Gary
Paying cash for services is NOT criminal activity.
Stop being such a sheep with your life.
Don't believe what government tells you.
Income tax and others taxes is a BIG FRAUD A LIE
put upon our country to pay for their unions and fat cat politicians and to have control over your 100 year existance on earth.
( less if they manage to kill you before you reach 100!)
There is no income tax act in canada.
If there is then show it to me !
Gary is symptomatic of our brainwashed propagandized mind set here in Canada.
Getting screwed by all levels of government will not end today or tomorrow BUT if people wake up and fight back a bit instead of rolling over like pansies then just maybe there is hope. I tend to think we've already lost the fight when you have close to 50% of voters ready to toss their life and money away by voting for more taxation and more union power.
We basically pay taxes so all these chumps can get their 2,5% whatever increase yearly like clock work and everyone else has suck muck.
Wake up Gary
Posted by: banjotom at June 18, 2006 07:54 AM (h+um8)
22
If the Fed. Gov. were to raise the tax from 7% to 8% you could be sure the cities would have it raised overnight. They have had some time allready to have some staffer make the change notice (affective July 1...). It is disrespect of the citizen that they feel it is to dificult and time consuming to do. Civil servants will only do as little as the have to do, extra is to "stressful".
Posted by: Cal at June 18, 2006 09:24 AM (TnqMl)
23
It's never 'too difficult to change things' when they're RAISING the taxes, though...is it?
Having said that...it's better that the Torontonians have to suffer for Toronto than trying to leech it from the rest of us, so suffer on ya begs
D
Posted by: David Lockwood at June 18, 2006 10:22 AM (7JfpS)
24
Seems to me this is a simple case of graft. The municipal government of Toronto is illegitimately realizing financial gain from monies which are rightfully the consumers'.
Toronto must be a great place to be these days. A racist provincial government tacitly recognizing a native version of sharia law on its reserves and a municipal government stealing its citizens' money.
People used to hate Toronto because they were jealous. Now it's just pathetic. What happened to you guys?
Posted by: potato at June 18, 2006 09:23 PM (QTyEg)
25
Edmonton announced this morning that they too will be keeping the extra 1% 'cause the amount is so small-$300,000- that they can't be bothered. If i, as a business owner kept the gst i charged you can bet that the government would not consider it too small to bother with even if it was only $300.
Posted by: lynda at June 19, 2006 12:35 PM (LJlof)
26
Ahem....pardon me.....Had your beloved CONSERVATIVE GOVERNMENT not introduced the GST in the first place (after raising many other taxes just to justify introducing the GST)this discussion would not be taking place.Or do you folks simply wish to stick your heads in the sand and scream Liberal inaction? WAKE UP !!
Posted by: at June 20, 2006 09:11 PM (pFDZ2)
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